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  1. #41
    Senior Member Nicko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanyptianFit View Post
    So I couldn't stand it anymore and I finally bit the bullet and "moved to Canada". I found out that 1/3 of my troops also live in Canada! Hey neighbors!

    So I've had about a day and a half playing with PvP and it is cool, and my experience is limited, but felt compelled to write.

    There is a lot of whining going on. It seems like people are expecting to have a single 4 man team that wins all the time. That isn't how it works. Nicko nailed it above by saying it all comes down to toon selection, and strategy. I like you Nicko! I actually don't mind going second and, like Nicko, I pick my toons strategically against each opponent and their team, and have faired very well. I don't have the prisoner, and by himself, he's not a problem. I've beat a ton of prisoner teams going second. They don't scare me. It is when someone thinks through the pairing of the prisoner with other toons that can make that character difficult. Every character has a nemisis, except the prisoner...although I guess another prisoner is his nemisis? I'm willing to accept that if that is what the developers choose. I'm not scared of the Corrupt General, again every character has a nemesis/weakness to exploit. My defense loses regularly. I accept that, because I could easily beat me too.

    I actually laugh after a tough back and forth battle that I lose. I failed to identify the foundational element of the defense. I just go back and win, order doesn't matter. But I really enjoy reading the defense to try and figure out the "weakness" that I will need to exploit to win. There are some creative MotherF**'s out there.

    I've read whining about multi-hitters and trolls and other characters and I don't think it is valid. I demonstrated the 21 DoT affects in one round, but that was an extreme example of a legitimate play. One where the Warrior Golden son would be worse than a glass canon, a glass canon shattered put back together that would break if the wind blew on it. In other words, I could never replicate that performance in PvP and win. I can't replicate that in the Cosmos either, I don't think. If you tried it in PvP it is a losing strategy for sure. I hope the developers realize this and take the complaints for what they are. Bugs should be fixed, but changing mechanics and nerfing should not be done lightly.

    Sparton, I'd love to be on the toon nerf advisory feedback team.

    This game is like an ecosystem, and changing the mechanics (a la multi-hitter approach) is very dangerous, and the wrong solution IMHO. The multi-hitters have a weakness too and they have a place in the game as designed.

    So here I sit with 40k trooper points and a decision. Do I buy 10 G/A souls or do I get 8 skill shards. Do I go for the prisoner or do I strengthen my team to fight him. It is my choice to make, we all have a choices.

    My 2.5 cents Canadian.
    Great post - and just logged in - and saw you beat me
    Nicko-0517

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicko View Post
    Great post - and just logged in - and saw you beat me
    You can be defeated if you go second... Problem is when you get the first round.

    @CanyptianFit

    This is to discuss broke mechanics, not nerfs. I myself is not a fan of nerfs AT ALL, but sometimes you can't tune something w/o nerfing it.

    Some broken mechanics as I said before is multiple hits procing talismans with every hit. Fixing this is not a nerf; you won't change multiple hits, you won't change talismans, just the way this is breaking PvP.

    But I also think Prisoner is a broken mechanic. If you go second against a prisoner team you will lose 100% of time, because people who own him will build teams that will CC enemies during the entire battle. You can't counter this in any way. Even if you put a team of sentinels with maxed health talismans you will lose w/o even reacting, it's just it'll take 3 rounds instead of 1. That's an example of a broken mechanic that cannot be fixed or solved w/o a nerf IMO.

    This is frustrating and infuriating because people like me will start dodging prisoner teams in order not to lose to a broken mechanic instead of a clever team. Oh yes I can always try another team w/o Prisoner... Just I don't. Today outta 10 enemies in my list 7 had Prisoner. 7 dodges... How can people climb if you need to dodge this mechanic all the time?

    "When I'm walking a dark road
    I am a man who walks alone"



    Account: Frost-6115. Feel free to check me. Actually trooper list is full, sorry

  3. #43
    Senior Member CanyptianFit's Avatar
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    Nicko, for the record I went second when I beat you.

    Frost, I don't agree with dodging prisoners. I'm not afraid of them and win regularly even when going second.

    Good discussion. That's what it all about.

  4. #44
    Senior Member Nicko's Avatar
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    I beat Prisoner teams going second all the time
    Nicko-0517

  5. #45
    Senior Member BillLion's Avatar
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    I also beat prisoner teams regularly. As someone said it's not just the Prisoner -it's who he's paired with and how they're built that makes the difference.

    Some teams if they go first I simply may not get even one turn to control my characters even if the match lasts a few rounds. Super frustrating, but the chance you have to take.

  6. #46
    Senior Member slauki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanyptianFit View Post
    Nicko, for the record I went second when I beat you.

    Frost, I don't agree with dodging prisoners. I'm not afraid of them and win regularly even when going second.

    Good discussion. That's what it all about.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicko View Post
    I beat Prisoner teams going second all the time
    the problem is not the prisoner himself, as stated before. the problem is the prisoner in combination with other chars and their synergies. i'm not afraid of a standalone prisoner. but if you combine him with the right chars you can create some strategies that will let you win a very high% of the time, when you go 1st. and the real problem is you cannot counter them without having a prisoner on your own side...some teams stunn 3/4 of my party or even more many many times. no immunity possible, no troll shield possible, no green bat possible, nothing anyone can do if he isn't extremly lucky.

    and one main problem causing this is the muliple proc chance of some talismans. sparton mentioned himself, that this is a bug and no intentional mechanic, so we are not talking about nerfing, we are talking about fixing at first.

    EDIT: @billion, you was faster as it seems
    Last edited by slauki; 01-11-2017 at 08:44 PM.


    don't be a mofo and join the mofos.

    if you are interested in joining one of the top 5 clans in lotb, contact me and we can start the negotiation. we are full atm but we can put you on the mofo list if you like.

  7. #47
    Senior Member BillLion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slauki View Post
    EDIT: @billion, you was faster as it seems
    Great minds, Slauki...

  8. #48
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    I still can't play pvp, but I have been testing several teams out using Autoplay at high level Underworld Madness levels. I don't have any of the main def guys, cc, troll, blue bat, death dog, prisoner so I have to get unique and building most of my team without passives.

    I really hope that these discussions don't do tremendous nerfing, it's already a lot slower going through 50 troopers a day then it used to be, even at lower levels. I can see that PVP causing nerfs can really affect the future of PVE.

    One thing it seems, I can stop trying to get shards in my Desert Marauder since it seems it will be slaughtered soon. I don't see the 100% proc playing PVE, but will pay more attention to it tonight.

    If people really think they need to beat every defensive team out there then what good is PVP? It's not really PVP anyway, it's player against another players AI setup, it also boils down to, other than toons, most of the player based is max level/talismans anyway.
    Thursty-1116

  9. #49
    Senior Member BillLion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shifter View Post
    I still can't play pvp, but I have been testing several teams out using Autoplay at high level Underworld Madness levels. I don't have any of the main def guys, cc, troll, blue bat, death dog, prisoner so I have to get unique and building most of my team without passives.

    I really hope that these discussions don't do tremendous nerfing, it's already a lot slower going through 50 troopers a day then it used to be, even at lower levels. I can see that PVP causing nerfs can really affect the future of PVE.

    One thing it seems, I can stop trying to get shards in my Desert Marauder since it seems it will be slaughtered soon. I don't see the 100% proc playing PVE, but will pay more attention to it tonight.

    If people really think they need to beat every defensive team out there then what good is PVP? It's not really PVP anyway, it's player against another players AI setup, it also boils down to, other than toons, most of the player based is max level/talismans anyway.
    My advice while you wait -keep pumping desert marauder with skill shards -he'll serve you well in PVP. And speaking of skill shards -use your trooper badges only for them even if you just stockpile them for now until you decide which characters to max.

  10. #50
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    My advice while you wait -keep pumping desert marauder with skill shards -he'll serve you well in PVP. And speaking of skill shards -use your trooper badges only for them even if you just stockpile them for now until you decide which characters to max.
    Exactly what I have been doing. I haven't spent a badge on souls since forever ago. I've just been collecting badges since i maxed my GR.
    Thursty-1116

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