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T-Man
07-17-2018, 02:52 AM
I noticed a top player lost to my defense a few times in a row, and the next time I ran across him on my list, he was running my exact defense. Made me chuckle. Lol

I don’t think anyone else was running this exact squad. I did work on this team for some time.

Anyway, I guess one should feel flattered when this happens.

What’s even funnier I could not beat my own team. The overwhelming amount of bugs did play a factor in the losses.

Anyway, how do you guys feel when you come up with a new (original) team and it gets copied? Can’t say I’m not guilty of coping.

Sidney
07-17-2018, 02:59 AM
I think it would be kinda flattering... Why don't you tell me your defense and I can see if I have the same problem... :D

Honestly sometimes I test my defense with the same offense and set it to auto and see how AI reacts. The AI defense does seem much smarter than the offense AI... You'd think they would be the same, but it hasn't been my experience.

T-Man
07-17-2018, 03:11 AM
I think it would be kinda flattering... Why don't you tell me your defense and I can see if I have the same problem... :D

Honestly sometimes I test my defense with the same offense and set it to auto and see how AI reacts. The AI defense does seem much smarter than the offense AI... You'd think they would be the same, but it hasn't been my experience.

Lol. Well I wanted to base it around Sekhmet since she was new and pretty bad ass. I really have not worked much on my defence in a long time. So I was happy to see it hold at least as good as my old D.

The bugs are really bad right now, so can’t judge it too much.

Sidney
07-17-2018, 03:35 AM
Lol. Well I wanted to base it around Sekhmet since she was new and pretty bad ass. I really have not worked much on my defence in a long time. So I was happy to see it hold at least as good as my old D.

The bugs are really bad right now, so can’t judge it too much.

Nice!!! I had some time last week and was looking around my inventory for something new to try and got to play the "Oh yeah... now I remember what I did with those talismans" game. I haven't really found a defense I'm too happy with lately... I really need to sit down and spend more time working on a better setup. Just not enough hours in the day. Tonight is a good night for this event as I'm just sitting around building new production servers for work and so I get more time to screw around while I wait for them to finish building... :D

T-Man
07-17-2018, 03:39 AM
Sound like a plan. ;)
I haven't been motivated at all lately. Bugs are really bad lately, but I had too much time on my hands over the weekend.

rags-6094
07-17-2018, 06:46 AM
Hi T-man and Sidney, can you guys tell me (speaking of defence) will destiny talismans stack? I.e will you get 40% less damage done to the whole team if placing 2/4 characters in the PVP defence team with destiny talismans?

Olevipoeg
07-17-2018, 07:46 AM
"Good Artists Copy; Great Artists Steal" --- Steve Jobs, Pablo Picasso, T. S. Eliot, W. H. Davenport Adams, Lionel Trilling, Igor Stravinsky, William Faulkner, etc :D

Blade
07-17-2018, 09:05 AM
Hi T-man and Sidney, can you guys tell me (speaking of defence) will destiny talismans stack? I.e will you get 40% less damage done to the whole team if placing 2/4 characters in the PVP defence team with destiny talismans?

The devs said they would not stack a while ago, when Destiny was a pay-only thing. Also, GPD + Destiny does not stack, as the larger number rules (so 35% > 20%).

Shaolin85london
07-17-2018, 10:32 AM
Sound like a plan. ;)
I haven't been motivated at all lately. Bugs are really bad lately, but I had too much time on my hands over the weekend.

Hi Tman, I ve noticed that you tried to pm me. Sorry inbox was full 😅
I ve cleared few room, u may text me now 👍

scott-5496
07-17-2018, 10:44 AM
I have copied a few defences and attacks over my time - maybe less so now as the teams on show are all sort of the same at the top end of the PVP board - it is more to do with adjusting to a meta and having the toons to do it of course - no gods for me yet so cant do that but happy enough with the defence I have at the moment - it has been the same for a few weeks now and was the same before that for a while though I did test some stuff out a wile back based purely on me struggling to win vs the same team several times - it was a nightmare until I realised I made a silly mistake in my set up then I got why I could not beat that team.

No one really copies me but if they did I would be good with that! I thin it is more about the meta - my defence is never far off the defences of the top 50 players...other than I dont always have the relics they have. I have not really checked other relics in a while btu there are goint obe a lot of players out there with no just the 80% defence but close to that max on the attack side too.....I am a long way off that as arena is the bit I dont have a lot of manual play time for! I could see top players being close to auto play in arena with the maxed out toons, full roster and relics to the hilt....I am sure there are several on the forum close to that if not doing that already! Good for them too...I wish I had the mobile play time to do it but I can only play so much and it is all mostly grinding on auto play.

T-Man
07-17-2018, 11:56 AM
Hi T-man and Sidney, can you guys tell me (speaking of defence) will destiny talismans stack? I.e will you get 40% less damage done to the whole team if placing 2/4 characters in the PVP defence team with destiny talismans?

I only have one set, but I don't think they stack, but I could be wrong. Have only run into this a few times.

T-Man
07-17-2018, 11:59 AM
Lol. though I don't necessarily agree with that. Where is the originality man? ;)

T-Man
07-17-2018, 12:02 PM
The devs said they would not stack a while ago, when Destiny was a pay-only thing. Also, GPD + Destiny does not stack, as the larger number rules (so 35% > 20%).

Thanks for confirming.

T-Man
07-17-2018, 12:03 PM
Hi Tman, I ve noticed that you tried to pm me. Sorry inbox was full ��
I ve cleared few room, u may text me now ��

Cool, I'll hit you back sometime today.

T-Man
07-17-2018, 12:08 PM
I have copied a few defences and attacks over my time - maybe less so now as the teams on show are all sort of the same at the top end of the PVP board - it is more to do with adjusting to a meta and having the toons to do it of course - no gods for me yet so cant do that but happy enough with the defence I have at the moment - it has been the same for a few weeks now and was the same before that for a while though I did test some stuff out a wile back based purely on me struggling to win vs the same team several times - it was a nightmare until I realised I made a silly mistake in my set up then I got why I could not beat that team.

No one really copies me but if they did I would be good with that! I thin it is more about the meta - my defence is never far off the defences of the top 50 players...other than I dont always have the relics they have. I have not really checked other relics in a while btu there are goint obe a lot of players out there with no just the 80% defence but close to that max on the attack side too.....I am a long way off that as arena is the bit I dont have a lot of manual play time for! I could see top players being close to auto play in arena with the maxed out toons, full roster and relics to the hilt....I am sure there are several on the forum close to that if not doing that already! Good for them too...I wish I had the mobile play time to do it but I can only play so much and it is all mostly grinding on auto play.

This game is all about coping. People go with what works. Only a few toons are worth a crap in the arena during a particular meta. It also appear to me the relics aren't always active. But that is a topic for another time..

Stormseye
07-17-2018, 01:54 PM
I would have no problem with someone using the same characters as me though I don't think anyone does as far as defense because I don't have Primordials so I had to be a bit more creative. Even without the current IE/Prisoner meta defense I still manage between 25-30% Defense wins. I never had much success when I did try and copy some of the top guys defenses. Maybe it was the talismans maybe it was the relics.

My favorite attack team was created by me but I was surprised to find a couple of others using it as a defense. Like others said isn't really about copying as it is using what is working well at the moment. Some character change and synergies work better than before so that's what people gravitate to. Early in the week rollover I will test different odd characters to try and discover something new. Recently I was playing with Magus Golden Son and found his heals to be insanely high on perfect hits. I equipped him with a Destiny set and was able to win a match or two against lowered ranked guys. That will probably not change my defense team but it was neat to see something new succeed at any level. There are so many great strategists that play this game and though luck of characters and talismans may dictate some wins, most of it is by design of teams and how well you understand how the Ai will play them. That is what makes great defense teams and why they do get copied. They work, pure and simple.

rags-6094
07-17-2018, 07:02 PM
My defence victorys are similar to you Stormseye and I don't run Primordials in any of my teams currently.
Perhaps we could start a non-primordials alliance?lol!

Thanks for the heads up on destiny talisman Blade!

Kamuz24z
07-18-2018, 06:59 AM
Welcome to the club Tman get used to it thanks to NF there is nothing you can do about it i know who the other guy is at that moment I didnít know who came up with the idea now i know
I guess is your best hold rate in a while
At this point I donít even bother about creating a new defense all the time that it takes testing over and over just to get it copy for some lazy guys the only time they spend is checking your account to copy the talismans thatís the reason many amazing players left
The only advantage that you can have over the guys copying you defense is buying all the new talismans and thatís what this game has become players can see every offense team you use against the defense they straggle the most and copy it there is no mystery anymore.

Yup
07-18-2018, 08:36 AM
You mean it's not okay to use Iron Eddie, Magus Lilith, The Prisoner, and Sentinel Lilith? I mean I jsut want to be a "joiner" not a leader :)

(note that is NOT my defense :) but is seems to be everyones in the 2700-3200 range. )

Shaolin85london
07-18-2018, 12:05 PM
Welcome to the club Tman get used to it thanks to NF there is nothing you can do about it i know who the other guy is at that moment I didnít know who came up with the idea now i know
I guess is your best hold rate in a while
At this point I donít even bother about creating a new defense all the time that it takes testing over and over just to get it copy for some lazy guys the only time they spend is checking your account to copy the talismans thatís the reason many amazing players left
The only advantage that you can have over the guys copying you defense is buying all the new talismans and thatís what this game has become players can see every offense team you use against the defense they straggle the most and copy it there is no mystery anymore.

Ok now I ve to step in on this. Sunday i ve faced an interest team composed by cyborg and sekmeth. Ivanbig was the owner. I ve struggled but manage to win. This the good results in GOF X makes me to try sekmeth in arena. Fully sharded I've paired with cyborg and two magus lilith. This was happening on Sunday, I then switched one magus lilith with green one and def rate start to raise. When I met kamuz def team, I got slashed because his purple Lilith was the real charger of his team. This plus ratio def went down and becosh his lilith makes a lot of sense, I've decided to give her a go. So green lilith off. And on this u can easily see talisman during the match above every character. Furthermore all this was happening Sunday. Monday I got attacked by Tman first time since I ve setted the new defence. And then I ve noticed he got the same asset. So I'm sorry but I didn't copy any, I ve simple used my skils and experience to setup a new wall team, stealing some concepts on the way. Def both ivanbig and kamuz has been a good inspiration. This game is based on pick up what works best and this is what I did. Cheers

Patrice-1201
07-18-2018, 12:58 PM
Ok now I ve to step in on this. Sunday i ve faced an interest team composed by cyborg and sekmeth. Ivanbig was the owner. I ve struggled but manage to win. This the good results in GOF X makes me to try sekmeth in arena. Fully sharded I've paired with cyborg and two magus lilith. This was happening on Sunday, I then switched one magus lilith with green one and def rate start to raise. When I met kamuz def team, I got slashed because his purple Lilith was the real charger of his team. This plus ratio def went down and becosh his lilith makes a lot of sense, I've decided to give her a go. So green lilith off. And on this u can easily see talisman during the match above every character. Furthermore all this was happening Sunday. Monday I got attacked by Tman first time since I ve setted the new defence. And then I ve noticed he got the same asset. So I'm sorry but I didn't copy any, I ve simple used my skils and experience to setup a new wall team, stealing some concepts on the way. Def both ivanbig and kamuz has been a good inspiration. This game is based on pick up what works best and this is what I did. Cheers

and the exact same thing happened on my side, experimentation lead to this exact same defence ;-)

Shaolin85london
07-18-2018, 01:34 PM
and the exact same thing happened on my side, experimentation lead to this exact same defence ;-)

Exactly Patrice. IE/clansman magus lilith Destiny shield along with, drop down since middle of the last week. Now is Sekmeth the game charger, and the right team devoloped around her fury. Cheers

T-Man
07-18-2018, 01:38 PM
Welcome to the club Tman get used to it thanks to NF there is nothing you can do about it i know who the other guy is at that moment I didnít know who came up with the idea now i know
I guess is your best hold rate in a while
At this point I donít even bother about creating a new defense all the time that it takes testing over and over just to get it copy for some lazy guys the only time they spend is checking your account to copy the talismans thatís the reason many amazing players left
The only advantage that you can have over the guys copying you defense is buying all the new talismans and thatís what this game has become players can see every offense team you use against the defense they straggle the most and copy it there is no mystery anymore.

You said it perfectly. Btw- Mad props to you for creating some of the most unique defenses the game has ever had. I spent hours experimenting to put this one together.

I get the copying, especially for younger players. Experienced players should try and be more creative when they can. When they have the time.

T-Man
07-18-2018, 01:45 PM
Ok now I ve to step in on this. Sunday i ve faced an interest team composed by cyborg and sekmeth. Ivanbig was the owner. I ve struggled but manage to win. This the good results in GOF X makes me to try sekmeth in arena. Fully sharded I've paired with cyborg and two magus lilith. This was happening on Sunday, I then switched one magus lilith with green one and def rate start to raise. When I met kamuz def team, I got slashed because his purple Lilith was the real charger of his team. This plus ratio def went down and becosh his lilith makes a lot of sense, I've decided to give her a go. So green lilith off. And on this u can easily see talisman during the match above every character. Furthermore all this was happening Sunday. Monday I got attacked by Tman first time since I ve setted the new defence. And then I ve noticed he got the same asset. So I'm sorry but I didn't copy any, I ve simple used my skils and experience to setup a new wall team, stealing some concepts on the way. Def both ivanbig and kamuz has been a good inspiration. This game is based on pick up what works best and this is what I did. Cheers

I didn’t want to call anyone out by name, but there you go. All I know is when I faced your team you didn’t have this defense. After you lost to my team a few times, then the next time I faced you then had the same defense as me.

I feel like you are too experienced player to do that. Yes some teams had Cy and Sekhmet, but not all 4 the same as me.

Anyway, I tried to pm you before posting and then didn’t have time to get back to you yesterday.

T-Man
07-18-2018, 01:48 PM
and the exact same thing happened on my side, experimentation lead to this exact same defence ;-)

Hey Patrice, I usually run into you often, but not this week. Have not seen your team.

T-Man
07-18-2018, 03:32 PM
You mean it's not okay to use Iron Eddie, Magus Lilith, The Prisoner, and Sentinel Lilith? I mean I jsut want to be a "joiner" not a leader :)

(note that is NOT my defense :) but is seems to be everyones in the 2700-3200 range. )

Yes that one was used by a player or 2 for a while. ;) Prisoner was not a part of the team at first. G Lilith was.
Part of this is because IE was new and being damn strong didnít hurt either. Then the Prisoner got fixed plus the primortals.

The bigger issue is there is not good balance among the toons, especially the Eds. Over the past weekend I experimented with some of my old favorites. VH, Pharaoh and others. They mostly sucked and just could not compete.

If there was better balance, you have to think we would see at least a few more diverse teams.

Yup
07-18-2018, 04:07 PM
Well PvP has been HEAVILY weighted to specific Eddies since I started playing. When I started if you didn't have VHE there was no way you could compete at the top. (Then they nerfed him). Now there's at least 3 or 4 Eddies that may work, but due to other commonalities, there's the same 3 or 4 OTHER non-Eddies that seem to be necessary.

Really though... I'm finding Relics much more valuable. Once I have them all.. like in 2 years.. it may not matter which Eddie is in use.

I will say that the accuracy boost the D team gets is still just as frustrating as it's ever been :)

T-Man
07-18-2018, 04:34 PM
Well PvP has been HEAVILY weighted to specific Eddies since I started playing. When I started if you didn't have VHE there was no way you could compete at the top. (Then they nerfed him). Now there's at least 3 or 4 Eddies that may work, but due to other commonalities, there's the same 3 or 4 OTHER non-Eddies that seem to be necessary.

Really though... I'm finding Relics much more valuable. Once I have them all.. like in 2 years.. it may not matter which Eddie is in use.

I will say that the accuracy boost the D team gets is still just as frustrating as it's ever been :)

The D is absolutely boosted. Even my current team, when I use it on offense it isn’t as strong. Even the relics often feel as though they are not applied on offense.

Yup
07-18-2018, 04:45 PM
I think everything is applied, the D just gets that 15-20% accuracy boost so they block, steal, revive, echo, heal, shield, etc. way more often. Always funny when I lose, go back in and wipe out the entire D team with 1 turn.

And I agree the A team NEVER gets any boost so.... :)

Liebhild
07-18-2018, 11:46 PM
Even the relics often feel as though they are not applied on offense.

I really think that there is a bug also. Once I noticed, that my relics aren't there, so I bought another one and all was fine again.

Olevipoeg
07-19-2018, 06:21 AM
You said it perfectly. Btw- Mad props to you for creating some of the most unique defenses the game has ever had. I spent hours experimenting to put this one together.

I get the copying, especially for younger players. Experienced players should try and be more creative when they can. When they have the time.
Why should we care? Really? The top teams are so similar anyway, i don't even remember usernames. For me there are only two kinds of teams. Ones with prisoner and ones without.

rags-6094
07-19-2018, 06:34 AM
I suspect I had my Sekhmet before almost anyone of the top contenders and had her in my team from almost day dot.
Does that mean that your copying me T-man:eek:

rags-6094
07-19-2018, 06:40 AM
At the end of the day there's a counter for what ever we do to our defence once you have all the relics the rest of us won't be far behind and it will be a more even playing field, the only thing between us will be the toons at our disposal and not being too lazy to change your attack team to suit the defence ( something I'm regularly guilty of):cool:

Stormseye
07-19-2018, 09:20 PM
Unfortunately that doesn't take into the account the ridiculous defense boost. Today alone I have lost so many matches because the defense Assassin Lillith just happens to revive the Sentinel Lillith who revives the whole party or the Fury meter just happens to go all the way full for Sekemet to Fury or you can never ever, ever land that Perfect Corruption on the defense Magus Lillith with Destiny but they can land it every time on your Magus Lillith. Let's not even begin to discuss the amount of Hidden/Double Golden buff bugs going on now. Saw a Prisoner revive today 4 times in a row. Once from AoM, Once from AoM buffs and 2 more times from mystery buffs. Every time I attacked and killed him, he revived. Finally killed him after his 4th. It is already bad enough dealing with the Primordial D-fest but the AI boost is clearly way out of hand. And please don't try and even say there is no defense boost. We all know it exists so tune it the F down already and stop making it completely obvious. Time and time again I will look at opponents relics and see they have maybe 20% global health and a smattering of other relics and they destroy my side with ALL health relics maxed. Come on just stop. That bonus is not just for Accuracy Yup. It is quite apparent that over the last patches they have increased AI Defense damage output and max health in the AI boost.

Yup
07-19-2018, 10:02 PM
I've been watching the Perfect Corruption buff sit on Defense teams while they gain, immunity, perfect immunity, shields, invincibility... all day long.

I swear this week seems to be worse than previous weeks. The D boost is ridiculous with some things.

I can't say wether they've boosted any stats. I think it's still just an accuracy boost. It's not that the D teams are "stronger" or "more healthy" it's that they land the right hits needed every freakin time. I mean Crit Strike always lands on the hardest hitter, not the blocker.... and Perfect Immortality always lands on the blocker/healer not the hitter. And they never get stunned, never have buffs stolen... it's just been utterly ridiculous this week.

Stormseye
07-19-2018, 10:08 PM
And they never get stunned, never have buffs stolen... it's just been utterly ridiculous this week.

Every time I have Trap on everyone of my characters from PoM and defense Gunner Lillith steals, she never gets stunned. She just loses her buffs and that's all.

Peppoah
07-19-2018, 10:12 PM
Unfortunately that doesn't take into the account the ridiculous defense boost. Today alone I have lost so many matches because the defense Assassin Lillith just happens to revive the Sentinel Lillith who revives the whole party or the Fury meter just happens to go all the way full for Sekemet to Fury or you can never ever, ever land that Perfect Corruption on the defense Magus Lillith with Destiny but they can land it every time on your Magus Lillith. Let's not even begin to discuss the amount of Hidden/Double Golden buff bugs going on now. Saw a Prisoner revive today 4 times in a row. Once from AoM, Once from AoM buffs and 2 more times from mystery buffs. Every time I attacked and killed him, he revived. Finally killed him after his 4th. It is already bad enough dealing with the Primordial D-fest but the AI boost is clearly way out of hand. And please don't try and even say there is no defense boost. We all know it exists so tune it the F down already and stop making it completely obvious. Time and time again I will look at opponents relics and see they have maybe 20% global health and a smattering of other relics and they destroy my side with ALL health relics maxed. Come on just stop. That bonus is not just for Accuracy Yup. It is quite apparent that over the last patches they have increased AI Defense damage output and max health in the AI boost.

And the best thing is when I look at the players names. It seems like itís always the same players that give me a hard time. As you said, they donít have full relics, but take no damage from my almost full relics team. I take a second turn and they fall down easy. Very strange. I have to make a list with the names. And I repeat, itís not the top players or TMan defense.