Reverting the past...

[Sag7272]

Was wondering this morning while browsing my inventory about all thoses toons that have been historically nerfed because of their long past meta...

Ain't that be a way to bring back some life in them?
I mean, in current state of the game with everything that had changed & newer powerful guys... Most of them would still have hard times out there but they'd have some interest instead of collecting dust..

First example that comes to mind, Sentinel corrupt droid...
That guy been nerfed back in beta PvP because "No Sentinel should do that kind of damages".... This argument is nowadays irrelevant with many examples to boot & SCD theses days is in most cases simply useless & overlooked... (Since he's been called the Sagbot I'm doubly sad about it lol)

Another BNW more controversial character, the infamous GCR... Back in the days she could hold a shitty team together alone, was obviously too much... But game had what 4 revivers back then & maybe 2 toons with permadeath..
Nowadays permadeath/perfect death/Doom are legion as are revivers far more powerful than her...

Thoses are just easy examples, they where OP in their days but theses days they would with their past powers just be useful at best...

Sure anyone can pinpoint one nerf that should be undone because irrelevant since their causes are long gone...
May put some life on the cheap for the older guys..
Maybe just a can of worms too..
Anyway just wondering..

[Nifelheim]

wrath nerf comes to mind. still has nice skills, but doesnt hit like an assassin...

[Yup]

There are so many...

When I started PVP was ruled by VHE and Wrath. You just could NOT beat those teams if you didn't have those characters. And the only way to get tWrath was to slowly, week after week collect frags. it took weeks before MAYBE getting lucky enough to randomly have Wrath drop form an Eternal soul. I had all the other eternals long before Wrath would drop for me. And VHE was one of the last available Eddies to drop for me at the time. Now all the Eternals are weak... no better than any other character in their class. VHE is among the weakest of the Eddies, just barely above the default Mummy/HS/Soldier/Wicker bunch. Revive was rare... a team with VHE, Wrath, and Immortal talismans was something to be feared... now it's never even getting close to higher levels.

Nature of the game is the power creep. Any adjustments to older characters in terms of INCREASE seems to me an effort to keep them from being laughable most of the time. I mean the Hallowed Ed buff was a good buff, but I think that was because he was a single target hitter only and no one ever used him (*cough*cough* Trooper/Killers Ed). But the buff to Rainmaker was horribly underwhelming. 32 Skill Shards and he's still pretty sad (*cough* Killers Ed).

I think they seem to have an internal "Power scale" and try to keep character at some level based upon the ease of acquisition. Since the Troopers and Eternals are kind of easily acquired now, they are weaker. I suspect that's the case for may 4 star characters as well.


Say what you will about RNG, but I firmly believe drop odds are "tweaked" for certain characters. Like the current event... 4 Aces and 3 Doomsday drops.. but not a single Count.... those odds are horrific. Stronger characters seem to drop much less often than the weaker characters even if the star level is the same.

[Peppoah]

Soldier Eddie comes to my mind. His fury did huge damage in the beginning. Roulette did heal the whole team. Astra‘s damage and stunning/removing. Void talismans became useless. Have to think about some others.

[HuckFinn150]

When I started Carriage Rider and From Reaper were top Eddies. The sad thing is GRE his a natural 5* and almost to the point of CRE. They both really need buffs to bring them back. No Eddie should be left so weak that no one wants to play them.

[Yup]

But the thing is.. if you're new... how weak would you see the "weak" eddies? Sure if you've been playing for a year have everything fully skill sharded, have more than 200 relics, and are hitting the top of PVP and doing well in the Guantlet and can farm any level anywhere mindlessly... some Eds are unusable or horribly underpowered. But if your'e still making your way through BNW for the first time.. is GRE really "weak"?

[HuckFinn150]

@Yup I guess him and CR are some of my favorites and I want to see them as strong as the new Eddies. 😌

[Peppoah]

I checked my roster and found a few other that were badly nerfed. First was PSS, Pharaoh Sun Spirit in case you forgot about this char. He did some huge damage in the very beginning. There was an extra thread for him. About the same time and he was one of my first sharded chars the blue allied soldiers shield was badly nerfed. He brought me very far in the game with his shield that did huge damage to the enemies. The next one was the green Axis Bomber Boy. When I first used him from a trooper he did huge damage. He was the first where I saw 20k damage AOE. Green harpy was a hard opponent in the beginning of the arena. As soon as I got her, she got nerfed. Golden Liliths damage nerf. Desert guardian could heal your whole team, now his heal is almost useless. I remember the nerf of blue CR, but don’t know what was the problem. I think it was her freezing with freeze talisman. And the last one I remember was the green UR when I faced him the first time in arena. He was the last man standing and I hardly could kill him because he was auto healing all the time and he could do some damage, too. I put shards on mine shortly after and used him sometimes in arena but was disappointed.
That’s it for now.
Cheers.

[Stormseye]

Pepp was taking me way back. The team that got me through most of the game was

Soldier Eddie - one of my top favorite Eddies. Roulette was amazing for healing and buffing the group.

Magus Allied Soldier - that shield was king. Nothing would get past it.

Warrior Sun Spirit - I recall that thread and I remember how great he was.

https://forum.ironmaidenlegacy.com/showthread.php?772-Pharaoh-Sun-Spirit-(Warrior)&highlight=Warrior+spirit


Assassin Possessed Mine - when they nerfed Magus Allied Soldier this became one of my first fully sharded 5* character. Man was he awesome

Gunner Corrupt Rescuer and Eda where also top allies at one time. Sadly I never got them until way after their prime.

So many lost good characters. I would enjoy seeing some of these old characters come back to life. I think many could benefit from just a damage boost.

[hold]

CR Ed, Red Troll and Red Helhound was my farming team ... bunch of pushovers they are now ...

I highly doubt they will get stronger again. That would be against the "business model" as you suddenly wouldn't need the P2W chars to stay on top.

Never forgotten: New characters make money and not new content! (Sparton)

[scott-5496]

There is a lot of sense for the team to buff many of the old characters - especially the Eddies and many four and five stars. For me the Eddies should be the main caharcter in all teams at all times - he is the boss surely so he need to be using skills to match. Many old Eddies are just collecting dust until maybe an event comes around where you need one of their old skills - really there only major value others than early stages of Gauntlet - well for many of them.

Natural five stars need to be that at all times - they need to be great characters with great skills - many are not. As others have mentioned Carriage Rider was a main part of my team in the first year of playing, as was Samurai, Mummy, SoL...even Wickerman and Soldier. You hardly ever see any of them ever unless it is early gauntlet stages. They could all do with a refurb as could several others including Vampire Hunter, Rainmaker and Storm. Again, and easy thing to do I think.

I do get why we have four and five star Eddies but it my view from day one they should all be five star or at least be the lynch pin of the team - whatever that team is. More often than not they are not the main element of a team. Dont get me started on Killers Eddie - I have not used him much at all as he just is not that good for much in my eyes - or at least I have not seen his niche yet and very rarely see him anywhere at all! Weird considering he is brand new!

[scott-5496]

I checked my roster and found a few other that were badly nerfed. First was PSS, Pharaoh Sun Spirit in case you forgot about this char. He did some huge damage in the very beginning. There was an extra thread for him. About the same time and he was one of my first sharded chars the blue allied soldiers shield was badly nerfed. He brought me very far in the game with his shield that did huge damage to the enemies. The next one was the green Axis Bomber Boy. When I first used him from a trooper he did huge damage. He was the first where I saw 20k damage AOE. Green harpy was a hard opponent in the beginning of the arena. As soon as I got her, she got nerfed. Golden Liliths damage nerf. Desert guardian could heal your whole team, now his heal is almost useless. I remember the nerf of blue CR, but don’t know what was the problem. I think it was her freezing with freeze talisman. And the last one I remember was the green UR when I faced him the first time in arena. He was the last man standing and I hardly could kill him because he was auto healing all the time and he could do some damage, too. I put shards on mine shortly after and used him sometimes in arena but was disappointed.
That’s it for now.
Cheers.

PSS, Green Bomber and Blue Allied soldier were my go to team and my three to get five star and had all my decent talisman - I remember them well and they were great as a team - PSS was my main guy - pretty sure he is a naural 1 star to start with too? Anyway, he was my guy and my very first full power team player! Ahhh, the good old days! LOL

[Sag7272]

Won't quote here & there we're all kinda lenghty & it'll look like a book before long lol...

The thread can go anywhere I don't mind but was somewhat specifically thinking about reverting some previous unnecessary nerfs..
We can all find toons or Eddies in need of love that subject is vast...
It technically even work in the P2W scheme as they would merely grow useful on a good day...

Someone reminded me about that poor red Troll... Seriously someone give him back his magma shield, was awful to face two years ago but now... Is it even really needed? PvE was that way and it worked can't see what it'd screw... Not even the P2W as he would still be seldom used..

Nerf bat used to be quite heavy back in the days some guys have all but simply been neutered.. For things that wouldn't even bring them up to par nowadays which is ridiculous...

AoF was damages nerfed twice... Before shield or damages reduction sets even exist! Back then only way against with high HP guys first turn was a Troll, was the Prisoners days tho... AoF WAS absolutely op, in that specific meta... It'd be a drop in water even on older specs now..

When I stop to think about it...
GCR, SCD & MAS... Thoses former top guys are my get to go punching bag team to test defense sequences, guess why... There's nothing good there anymore def will never be in danger..

[Killer-Frost]

Grim reaper desperately needs a buff...I hope he gets it on this month's toning

[Sag7272]

Grim reaper desperately needs a buff...I hope he gets it on this month's toning

Poor guy was used to be such a killing machine I remember his heydays, he's not shadow of himself..

[Killer-Frost]

Poor guy was used to be such a killing machine I remember his heydays, he's not shadow of himself..

Ikr. His slash doing 15k+ was godly back then. Now 15k just seems too small a number lol. Given as to how hard he use to be to get he deserves the next buff more than any other eddie

[rags-6094]

It's funny reading about all those old characters I never seemed to get until they weren't the latest and greatest anymore...
Whilst I have been playing since almost the beginning - but not on the forums till the last 12 months, I had no idea so many of those characters had been nerfed, I will have to trust you all on that.
I had another theory before seeing this thread on all those old characters, that they didn't get nerfed the characters that followed just evolved, got stronger, better passives, better skills, etc completely eclipsing there founding neighbours if you will.
So if what I'm hearing is true and I believe it is, then reversing all those nerfed characters buffs and skills/strengths back to their former glory.... does anyone think they would still be as useful, would it bring them back? I have my doubts they would be evenly matched against characters from say the past 6 months...

[HuckFinn150]

@rags-0694 it would help me and everyone else, as it would give more Magus Eddie's that can help in gauntlet. A stronger CR would have helped me get out of AAA.

[Amarthir]

Yeah Magus Eddie's are rather poor in general. We got Crusader, Seventh Son and King Eddie in A tier. And then Speed of Light, Grim Reaper and Mystic Eddie are more C tier, while Wickerman and Carriage Rider are shit tier bottom of the barrel.

Most of that entire class needs a rework.

[BonFire]

Prisoner got nerfed because of arena. Which is just rude. There was like 6 straight months of him not working properly because of the nerf to his passive. All the yellow passive effects nowadays don't know why he can't just go back to a full on passive block.

I remember Rainmaker having that one turn fury, which was nice. Supposedly a glitch, but if it wasn't, it would be cool to get a little closer to that again.

[osiris0000]

https://forum.ironmaidenlegacy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=1300&d=1475430397 Good old ancient times! This PSS was my first ever maxed character. Screenshot is from 2016, before the fierce talisman nerf. Game changed a lot for sure. Names too, not many 2016 players left, me included. But it is fun to follow here.

[rags-6094]

Osiris0000 can I ask you what character the Magis Eddie is you have a double of in that screenshot, did they change the profile picture for one of the Eddies ?
I thought I had all Eddies but I compared them and I don't have that one.....

[Fudjo]

Osiris0000 can I ask you what character the Magis Eddie is you have a double of in that screenshot, did they change the profile picture for one of the Eddies ?
I thought I had all Eddies but I compared them and I don't have that one.....

I'm pretty certain that's the old picture for Visions Eddie.

[infinite dreamer]

Osiris0000 can I ask you what character the Magis Eddie is you have a double of in that screenshot, did they change the profile picture for one of the Eddies ?
I thought I had all Eddies but I compared them and I don't have that one.....

That was the old pic for the speed of light Eddie. He was my go-to Eddie early on.

[Fudjo]

That was the old pic for the speed of light Eddie. He was my go-to Eddie early on.

Ahhhhh right, yeah. There was an update he got that made him very useful, and he was my go-to as well for quite some time.

[infinite dreamer]

Ahhhhh right, yeah. There was an update he got that made him very useful, and he was my go-to as well for quite some time.

I went through most of the original game with SOL Eddie and any combination of Magus Allied Soldier, Sentinel Allied Bomber Boy and Warrior COTD. Considering how challenging some of the highest levels on madness were, it's hard to believe how quickly they can be auto-played now. Skill shards were so rare back then.

[rags-6094]

Ahhh listen to us he he he.. what a bunch of old farts... "way back when the game was honest and the toons were good"
It was just over 2 years ago, it feels like it was 25+ years ago the way it's discussed... funny stuff, I used Carriage Rider in a SSS Gauntlet today along with other characters, and I blew Clansman and his cronies off the floor, I'm still skill sharding many of the originals for gauntlet.

What I've noticed is (not always) a lot of the time having one of the newer toons that can steal or negate golden buffs along with older toons that just hit mega hard, is enough to overcome a lot of those tough outfits in Gauntlet....

[osiris0000]

Osiris0000 can I ask you what character the Magis Eddie is you have a double of in that screenshot, did they change the profile picture for one of the Eddies ?
I thought I had all Eddies but I compared them and I don't have that one.....

It is SoL eddie like the others mentioned. Soldier eddie - Blue cheese allied soldier - PSS was the team i used to finish the game.

Game was less stressy back then, only problem was finding evo shards & runes for chars and talismans. No events, no sacrifice, pvp, gauntlet, so on. And it was raining rare souls at lord of light dungeons.

I was away from game for a long time. I have started another account when the gods of egypt introduced - they were one of the main reasons i started to play this game. Then collected them & played until I gone through whole Night city (because i had to play that really long waited world). After that it felt like I was done again. Good luck to the remaining players, it takes lot of effort nowadays to keep up with everything for sure.

[MetalKing]

My first team consisted of carriage rider Eddie, sentinel harpy, allied bomber boy, and warrior child of the dammed. He was great with explosive talismans. Later I got wrath. Shortly thereafter they hit wrath with a nerf. The team carried me to level 50 or 60.

[Sag7272]

🤔 Reviving the past there guys..
I begin to sound like an old fart talking about the good ol' days..

Back then I remember clearing NOTB with the then godly blue solider a 4* solider ed & a still single hitter hellhound... Anyone remember when overwhelming tallis where the highest hp around.. been a while..
Things have definitely changed!

[rags-6094]

My original team that carried me to level 100 consisted of Pharoah Eddie, Angel of Fear, GCOTD and Assasin Souless Demon was my first soul I earnt the first time I played through NOTB...
I was still using Pharoah Eddie this time last year as my champion... how things have changed! You can say that again!

[Zugzwang]

What is GRE? It’s not an Eddie is it? I never got into the abbreviations. I mean CRE I instantly knew meant Carriage Rider Eddie. Same with VHE for Vampire Hunter Eddie. But other than g for gunner etc I get lost. What is GRE?

[sumpfleiche]

GRE is Grim Reaper Eddie

[Sag7272]

What is GRE? It’s not an Eddie is it? I never got into the abbreviations. I mean CRE I instantly knew meant Carriage Rider Eddie. Same with VHE for Vampire Hunter Eddie. But other than g for gunner etc I get lost. What is GRE?

GRE is Grim Reaper Eddie

Think that settle it.... Nobody uses him now.. That's why he's not obvious anymore lol

[scott-5496]

GRE was king for many weeks, maybe months if I remember. He did a lot fo good for my team that is for sure! So many dead caharacters in the game though with recent events and targets to hit it has been nice to dust a few off!

[Olevipoeg]

GRE was my first fully sharded Eddie...

[Muzzleloader]

When GRE was still used it was a simpler time. Visions Eddie immunity steal and stuns were dreaded, VHE revive was feared and Pharoah Eddie put us in the grave. Now these Eddie's are barely used outside of the gsuntlet. Nomads single hit was a killer and vanish was an eyesore.

[scott-5496]

When GRE was still used it was a simpler time. Visions Eddie immunity steal and stuns were dreaded, VHE revive was feared and Pharoah Eddie put us in the grave. Now these Eddie's are barely used outside of the gsuntlet. Nomads single hit was a killer and vanish was an eyesore.

Yup, for sure. It was a vastly different time indeed - the game is a lot better since then though - I mean we had crashes all the time back then and really bad game destroying bugs etc. More characters is great too but maybe they are pushing that too much but I suppose the Night City launch was always going to generate that....same with the next place too - they know that characters means money so I think that will push them along to get Avalon moving eventually! Oh and where is out state of the nation for 2019 - nothing yet I see?!?

[Ironstyle]

Oh and where is out state of the nation for 2019 - nothing yet I see?!?

This is the main reason I come to this forum right now, haha.