July 2021, Preliminary Tuning - DISCUSSION

[Leviathan]

Discuss the July Tuning Notes here!

Here's a link to our Preliminary Tuning Notes. (https://forum.ironmaidenlegacy.com/showthread.php?14262-July-2021-Tuning-PRELIMINARY)

[Shaolin85london]

Thank you for revamping the talisman souls as many old set are now of not much use more than sitting in the talisman inventory. Also thank you for the inventory slot expansion.

[GrimDusk]

Lots of fun stuff coming this month, so I am going to give my thoughts as concisely as possible.

Trooper Eddie getting a rework is long overdue. He's one of the most iconic Eddies and for him to not be worth using is quite unfortunate. His skills will definitely fit the whole "bruiser support" thing he has going with the extra damage and better effects. I will say that awakening him is cool, but my one issue (if any) is that he requires a new type of shard. We already have Trooper Shards. This is a problem I also have with Ghost of the Navigator using Paranoia shards when Nautical Shards exist. I feel like every new tuning we get several different shards that make the older ones obsolete. Cyborg shards are still used for only one character.

Final Frontier Eddie getting an awakening was sort of expected. He's the only consistent character from Gauntlet, and the entire mode has his face plastered all over it. I think it'll be quite a treat to have him wreck shop.

Labyrinth getting a hard dungeon isn't surprising. That leaves us with Mystic Night as the only class restricted dungeon with no hard mode. I do wonder if the Labyrinth will be even more difficult now, with awakened Daedalus and Icarus.

This is the biggest part of the tuning notes here: Brave New World is now going to have fully separated class dungeons rather than lump magus/assassin and gunner/sentinel. That is amazing, and BNW X not dropping talismans means that there's finally a BNW level that we can farm without having inventories fill immediately.

Talisman soul update is interesting, but nothing crazy.

Summer Ride Charlotte and Chords of Command Eddie getting the ability to use bespoke talismans is nice. Chords of Command Eddie getting a visual update is also great; it was difficult to tell what he was doing with each command.

Number of the Beast Eddie/Chords of Command Eddie getting Possession updated is really good, but we don't know specifics yet. A lot of people complained about the Dark Ghost being added, as it slowed down his farming greatly.

Overall, awesome update. I look forward to seeing what's in store for August!

[dragonmat89]

Looks like some interesting changes. Will we need to re-unlock the new BNW levels? No hardship but just curious. Also, will the Trooper/Battlefield Trooper Eddie changes be reflected in US Cavalry Eddie as well or will he keep the old skillset...?

[Ruby_LOTB]

Looks like some interesting changes. Will we need to re-unlock the new BNW levels? No hardship but just curious. Also, will the Trooper/Battlefield Trooper Eddie changes be reflected in US Cavalry Eddie as well or will he keep the old skillset...?

Unlocking BNW again is a requirement. Trooper/Battlefield Trooper/U.S. Cavalry Eddies are all updated.

[Fudjo]

I like these tuning notes.

[MuzakMaker]

I love the "Increse" of character slots up to 800. Makes it much easier to just drop a whole stack if you wind up going over the soul limit while grinding a keyed dungeon.

I'm still wary about Number of the Beast. For the high cost of awakening, I don't want to futz around with an enemy team that's still alive. I want to kill them outright. Ghost and dark ghost have long been what I consider the worst effects in the game and I would not waste all of that time and effort on Number of the Beast Ed to awaken him now.

[Tsuketa]

I'm with MuzakMaker. It's almost always the case that casting Dark Ghost hurts you more than it helps. You absolutely can not use a character who has the ability to Dark Ghost in autoplay. That will only hurt you.

Even worse is the longstanding bug where you attack someone and they somehow cast Ghost (the gold "buff") on 1 - 4 members of your team. I've lost gauntlet battles by killing a Clairvoyant and having my entire team get a 1 turn gold ghost, then immediately die when the current turn is over.

If I could change one thing about the game ... well, I'd make it easier to move talisman sets around. But if I could change one combat thing about the game, I'd remove ghost and dark ghost entirely.

[MisterEly]

Finally, Trooper Ed is getting some love, hooray!


On the topic of the various Ghost effects, I find it infinitely more annoying when an enemy team can apply Ghost to yours, usually due to the Soul talismans that the devs just *love* to slap on the Clairvoyant in Gauntlet. Dark Ghost can be cleansed easily enough, but Ghost is a total monkey wrench in that it can only have its duration extended, or else you're just fucked.

On the other side of the coin, Dark Ghost in a PvE scenario just slows everything down tenfold. Chances are, the enemy has nothing to cleanse Dark Ghost with, and if you don't bring a character that can apply Permadeath, you're forced to waste time. Maybe with this upcoming change to NOTB Ed, we may see him apply Permadeath to, or even instantly kill any enemy inflicted with Dark Ghost to counteract the fact that he applies it with a basic attack, and as it stands, every time he uses said attack, the turn timer for the effect resets (I'm going entirely off of the words of one of my Troopers who would usually use NOTB Ed when grinding the warrior cosmic talisman dungeon).

[MarkyMark]

There are a lot of great improvements in this tuning update.

However, while I'm not normally one to howl with outrage, I do find it very annoying that Ghost of the Navigator's awakening requires the Paranoia awakening shards rather than the Nautical ones which seem to match his class a lot better.

The Paranoia ones are very rare and most players spent the 6 that were available for a recent event on Piece of Mind Ed, as he was the only toon that apparently needed them (plus he could be used for a new achievement in the Powerslave dungeon which was part of the monthly event currency line-up).

Of course we don't know what his awakening will be yet, but given Ghost of the Navigator jumped straight into the meta when released, I'm expecting the awakening will probably put him right back up there. It would've been nice to know this was coming before we all burned those Paranoia shards.

[dragonmat89]

Unlocking BNW again is a requirement. Trooper/Battlefield Trooper/U.S. Cavalry Eddies are all updated.

Thanks for confirming US Cavalry is being tuned too :)

On the discussion of Ghost/Dark Ghost I agree that having Ghost cast on your team is one of the hardest things to work against. You almost need to have perfect corruption on your team if fighting a Clairvoyant in Gauntlet to prevent being hit by the 'buff'. From an attacking point of view, having the ability to cast Ghost and then remove beneficial effects is more reliable than Dark Ghost and Permadeath just because there's a lot less inherent immunity to it.

[Olevipoeg]

I'm with MuzakMaker. It's almost always the case that casting Dark Ghost hurts you more than it helps. You absolutely can not use a character who has the ability to Dark Ghost in autoplay. That will only hurt you.

Even worse is the longstanding bug where you attack someone and they somehow cast Ghost (the gold "buff") on 1 - 4 members of your team. I've lost gauntlet battles by killing a Clairvoyant and having my entire team get a 1 turn gold ghost, then immediately die when the current turn is over.

If I could change one thing about the game ... well, I'd make it easier to move talisman sets around. But if I could change one combat thing about the game, I'd remove ghost and dark ghost entirely.
I have fought thousands of Gauntlet SSS battles. The Soul talisman never affects all your chars. If this happens, then probably because of Talisman or Passive copying positive effects. There is only 5 regular teams in SSS having Soul set. You just need to remember which ones.

[Barthax]

I'm a little disappointed about the lack of talismans on the new level X BNWs. I quit liked selling 'em off for a little extra gold while farming for Cosmic Dungeon keys.

[MarkyMark]

I'm a little disappointed about the lack of talismans on the new level X BNWs. I quit liked selling 'em off for a little extra gold while farming for Cosmic Dungeon keys.

The drops on IX are basically identical, and the big plus is that you can now happily auto run X for BNW events without talisman inventory overflow interrupting it all the time.

[Maiden]

Nice Tunning there! One of the best in the latest times. Final Frontier and Trooper needed an extra push even after their bespoke talisman! Champing at the bits to see their skills. Same with Gotn, he is really good and I wasn't expecting that, eager to see how he evolves! Also, thanks for the small and not so small fixes and Gaming improving like more slots (also unexpected but welcomed), the BnW separation, souls, and bug fixes!

Btw jumping in the chat about Soul Talisman, I think it is bugged (or it was?) Your team does get Ghosted in more than one member of your team, despite that the suggestion about copying the effect sounds also possible, every time that I got my team almost full ghosted was because I killed the souls talisman user with a multihitter. It is also possible to get ghosted when the enemy reached Hp1 but something prevents them from dying.

If Ghost is going to stay as buff/debuff in-game, it should at least be near impossible to remove. Stripping Golden Effects today is the bread and butter of the game, shouldn't be so easier.

[Iced_Earth]

The Update isn Life, or?

[Barthax]

The drops on IX are basically identical, and the big plus is that you can now happily auto run X for BNW events without talisman inventory overflow interrupting it all the time.

That's where I disagree. :) Farming for keys and getting to sell off a bunch of talisman is why I run X - extra credit. :P Run Garden of Fear X & you don't even have to scroll far to sell them...

[osarbu]

The drops on IX are basically identical, and the big plus is that you can now happily auto run X for BNW events without talisman inventory overflow interrupting it all the time.

I also think this is a great update for BNW X.
However, even better would be adding a second button on auto-replay (so that it applies to all dungeons/worlds): "Sell Talismans Auto – If ON, will sell each obtained Talisman immediately. If OFF, Talismans will be kept"
Wouldn't that be great?

[Barthax]

I also think this is a great update for BNW X.
However, even better would be adding a second button on auto-replay (so that it applies to all dungeons/worlds): "Sell Talismans Auto – If ON, will sell each obtained Talisman immediately. If OFF, Talismans will be kept"
Wouldn't that be great?


Or... dump anything you want to keep on the new 1200 new talisman slots the extra chars can carry and have 800 free slots to sell off at the end. :P (No dev work messing up what it automatically sells. :P )

[osarbu]

There are a lot of great improvements in this tuning update.

However, while I'm not normally one to howl with outrage, I do find it very annoying that Ghost of the Navigator's awakening requires the Paranoia awakening shards rather than the Nautical ones which seem to match his class a lot better.

The Paranoia ones are very rare and most players spent the 6 that were available for a recent event on Piece of Mind Ed, as he was the only toon that apparently needed them (plus he could be used for a new achievement in the Powerslave dungeon which was part of the monthly event currency line-up).

Of course we don't know what his awakening will be yet, but given Ghost of the Navigator jumped straight into the meta when released, I'm expecting the awakening will probably put him right back up there. It would've been nice to know this was coming before we all burned those Paranoia shards.

The natural consequence of this decision would be then making the Paranoia Tali to work also on GotN.

[Tsuketa]

GotN already can wear the Nautical bespoke, but there are other characters who can use multiple bespokes (not at the same time, of course).

Case in point, I'm currently trying to decide whether to get 3 T3 and 1 T1 Legacy bespoke or the current monthly Eddie. I'm leaning toward the talis since they tend to be harder to get than Eddies (other than my nemesis, Day of the Dead...)

[Barthax]

GotN already can wear the Nautical bespoke, but there are other characters who can use multiple bespokes (not at the same time, of course).

Case in point, I'm currently trying to decide whether to get 3 T3 and 1 T1 Legacy bespoke or the current monthly Eddie. I'm leaning toward the talis since they tend to be harder to get than Eddies (other than my nemesis, Day of the Dead...)


I always target bespokes first as they're typically only available through events whereas characters come from multiple different sources. I can wait for specific char to arrive & in the mean time use a bespoke on a duplicate of the other supported chars in the meantime.

[dragonmat89]

FYI Server reboot expected 17:30 UTC today (so in 3.5 hours).

[Tsuketa]

Can someone confirm if the Legacy bespokes work on the alternate versions of the characters listed? For instance, it says "Trooper Eddie" and "Cyborg Eddie." Does that mean it also works on Battlefield Trooper Eddie, US Calvary Eddie, Bounty Hunter Eddie, and Cosmic Cyborg Eddie? That's how these things usually work, but the description wasn't clear in this case (it says "Trooper Eddie" instead of "Trooper Eddies").

[Ruby_LOTB]

Can someone confirm if the Legacy bespokes work on the alternate versions of the characters listed? For instance, it says "Trooper Eddie" and "Cyborg Eddie." Does that mean it also works on Battlefield Trooper Eddie, US Calvary Eddie, Bounty Hunter Eddie, and Cosmic Cyborg Eddie? That's how these things usually work, but the description wasn't clear in this case (it says "Trooper Eddie" instead of "Trooper Eddies").

The 8 characters that are listed are the only characters that the Legacy Bespokes work on. It does not work if placed on any other character.

[Tsuketa]

Great to know. Thanks Ruby!