Skill Shard Question: How skill levels does effect on characters?

[osiris0000]

Hello everyone,

I am playing this game for a long time. But never tested this : what kind of effect character get when we drop a skillshard? For example, it shows:

LVL-2 - Damage +%10
LVL-3 - Damage +%15

I wonder how this damage scales? If char's base attack value is 1000 k, and we have additional 2000 k damage with talismans. So char have 3000 k damage in total. Let's say we have %25 more damage according to skills.

If it only scales from base value (1000 k), we will have :
(Base damage) 1000k+ (Skill damage %25) 250 k + 2000 k (Talismans) = 3250 k

But if it scales with overall value (3000 k) , it will be
(Base + Talisman damage) 3000 k + (Skill damage %25) 750k = 3750 k.
500 k is a huge difference. And i know there is bigger values than this.

Does it only scales base value or overall value with talismans? Because if we know this, we can be more selective when throwing skill shards to characters. If no one knows, i will be also happy to hear this from devs :cool:

[Ancient Mariner]

Good question.
Speaking about this matter, what i've always wondered instead was:
Let's say i have a char dealing 1000 damage with an ability (regardless of talismans or not), and then i have:
- level 2 - Damage +10%
- level 3 - Damage +15%

the level 2 10% will increase the damage by 100 of course, but what about the 15% of level 3?
Will it scale based on the 1100 damage (considering the level 2) or always on the basic 1000 damage?

[Aristo4]

I think the extra 15% on lvl3 is added to the total damage you'd seen with lvl2.

I was monitoring this on my cyborg, when focusing investing skillshards on his skill 'beam'...he was hitting for 10k and then to 11,5k when the '+15%' skilshard came in.

[Ancient Mariner]

I think the extra 15% on lvl3 is added to the total damage you'd seen with lvl2.

I was monitoring this on my cyborg, when focusing investing skillshards on his skill 'beam'...he was hitting for 10k and then to 11,5k when the '+15%' skilshard came in.

cool, thanks

[osiris0000]

I think the extra 15% on lvl3 is added to the total damage you'd seen with lvl2.

I was monitoring this on my cyborg, when focusing investing skillshards on his skill 'beam'...he was hitting for 10k and then to 11,5k when the '+15%' skilshard came in.

This is a late response, but i wanted to check it twice when i start to invest skillshards again. So you mean this "+15%" counts with overall damage (base attack+talisman state)? If so, this is really cool to hear! So i can throw very interesting numbers based on my calculations:

I am focused on building a maxed magus team currently. I am investing in Corrupt General and Masked Harpy. I am having full freeze set on both of them.


Corrupt General:
Base AOE magic damage = 1085
Full Freeze set additional damage = 2718
Overall damage = 3776

Total AOE magic damage (with +30% boost with maxed skills) = 4908 k

Masked Harpy:
Base AOE magic damage = 856
Full Freeze set additional damage = 2718
Overall damage = 3574

Total AOE magic damage (with +45% boost with maxed skills) = 5182 k

So in the end, Masked Harpy does 274 k more AOE magic damage than Corrupt General. And of course with 70% chance for AOE Magic burn for 2 turns. Isn't it weird? (If we put full holy talisman sets, numbers may change due to Corrupt General's higher magic stat. But Masked Harpy beats Corrupt General on Magic Damage, when you put full Freeze set on both of them)

So now guess which one i am investing first.. Maybe it will sound weird to you but i choose Masked Harpy to max in first row.
Because she become my second hidden gem in the game with last tuning, after my previous legendary PSS :cool:

[Aristo4]

This is a late response, but i wanted to check it twice when i start to invest skillshards again. So you mean this "+15%" counts with overall damage (base attack+talisman state)? If so, this is really cool to hear!

Cant say if it counts with overall damage or if it takes into account base attack and talisman state separately...all I've noticing is the end damage you see in battle, and it was 15% added indeed :cool:

[satani]

The easiest answer is, see it yourself. unless the "exploit" is not fixed yet. You can clearly see the damage differences by using the "Max Skill Shard" Exploit reported in the Bugs-Section of this forum. All you need is a max skill-shard character of your non-shard character in your troopers list. I think, maxing skills by shards can power up your character very strongly. But to be honest, i think 5000 trooper points is a bit much, plus i'd like to have a remove skill shards option (even for ironites) because, in the beginning, you spent all skill shards you got in your first eddie (most likely soldier eddie) and now the talismans and some characters have been nerfed, your first choice eddie from beginning is not best anymore. Plus you may have gotten a better eddie by time

I'd like to remove the 12-13 skill shards from my eddie and pump them to my corrupt general.

[iPoop]

It's funny...I just asked Nodding Frog the following skill shard question:

How do skill shards scale? For example, if I place 4 skill shards on the purple golden son, is the total damage=damage*20%? Or is the total damage=((((damage*5%)*10%)*15%)*20%)?


This is the response I received:

When you throw on a skill shard, it does exactly what it says (i.e. increase damage by 20%). The damage doesn't scale off of previous power levels. So you're getting a 5% increase moving from Level 3 15% damage to Level 4 20% damage for instance.

[Aristo4]

It's funny...I just asked Nodding Frog the following skill shard question:

How do skill shards scale? For example, if I place 4 skill shards on the purple golden son, is the total damage=damage*20%? Or is the total damage=((((damage*5%)*10%)*15%)*20%)?


This is the response I received:

When you throw on a skill shard, it does exactly what it says (i.e. increase damage by 20%). The damage doesn't scale off of previous power levels. So you're getting a 5% increase moving from Level 3 15% damage to Level 4 20% damage for instance.

Funny :cool:

[Kaijester]

That doesn't make sense if it does not scale off previous skill level...several skills has lv2 + 5% and lv3 + 5%...?

[Esquatcho]

That doesn't make sense if it does not scale off previous skill level...several skills has lv2 + 5% and lv3 + 5%...?

I think what they mean is that the Lvl 3 isnt 5% on top of the 105% from Lvl 2. Instead its all up 110%.

[Arcturus]

It means that the percentages are cumulative so if it's:

lvl 1: +5%
lvl 2: +10%
lvl 3: +15%
lvl 4: +20%

then if you have two skill shards, it's the pre-skill shard damage x 15%, and if you have all 4 then it's pre-skill shard damage x 50%

[Reeb99]

I've always assumed that it modified the overall values of the skill itself, after the damage calculations for stats. Then add the sum of all levels. Talisman effects would have zero bearing or benefit from those skill shards.

I've noticed an increase in damage for every skill level that mentioned damage, regardless if it said the same thing as the previous level. It wouldn't make sense to do it any other way, as Kaijester said.

[blackbolt]

then if you have two skill shards, it's the pre-skill shard damage x 15%, and if you have all 4 then it's pre-skill shard damage x 50%

I perceived it the same way, seems more reasonable.

[osiris0000]

The easiest answer is, see it yourself. unless the "exploit" is not fixed yet. You can clearly see the damage differences by using the "Max Skill Shard" Exploit reported in the Bugs-Section of this forum. All you need is a max skill-shard character of your non-shard character in your troopers list.

Actually this is a good idea! Best way is the test and see, i agree. But in order to get realistic numbers; i would not try to test with a trooper, unless i have exact same talismans on same levels (which can be challenging). Everything must be same except skills. I will test this personally when i level a dupe related to one of my maxed chars (actually i have a maxed PSS, probably i will move another PSS to 5* lvl 100).

I will write back here when i test it. Because Skillshards are hardest items to get in this game. And it is important to see how it scales, so we can make better strategic decisions about this expensive and useful item.

[osiris0000]

Okay guys, i have spend some of my resources to move another PSS to 5* lvl 100 as a non-skillshard dupe, only for this test.

I have tested this only with my chars, no trooper involved. Everything is tested exactly in same situations, only difference is Skillshards.
I see this numbers 6 time in a row, so the damages i put below are fixed and 100% sure damages.

Here is the "REAL" results about how skillshard changes the damage:

Test Level - Battlefield - Adrenaline Rush (Madness)

Base Values of PSS :
Attack : 754 k
Talisman : 3057 k (Full Maxed Fierce Talisman Set all 5*- lvl 50)
Overall : 3811 k (Attack + Talisman attack total)
Tested Skill : "Rise". A maxed "Rise" skill boosts "+25%" more damage and some health. But i just tested the damage output here only.

Results:

None Maxed PSS : "Rise" Power Move Damage - 4699 on sentinel allied soldier - perfect hit
Full Maxed PSS : "Rise" Power Move Damage - 6579 on sentinel allied soldier - perfect hit

So, only with "+25%" boost on this skill i got 1880 k damage difference. And it is AOE damage.
With this results, now i am sure Skillshards not only scales by "base attack", it scales with Overall damage (Attack + Talisman).

From now on i will never regret saving my trooper points for Skillshards!

[Arcturus]

...
Results:

None Maxed PSS : "Rise" Power Move Damage - 4699 on sentinel allied soldier - perfect hit
Full Maxed PSS : "Rise" Power Move Damage - 6579 on sentinel allied soldier - perfect hit

So, only with "+25%" boost on this skill i got 1880 k damage difference. And it is AOE damage.
With this results, now i am sure Skillshards not only scales by "base attack", it scales with Overall damage (Attack + Talisman).

Well done. But that's 40% more damage, not 25%. I'm not sure I'll ever understand how damage is calculated in this game.

[Reeb99]

So it's cumulative like we thought. Good to have confirmation.

[iPoop]

So I followed up with Nodding Frog again based upon this discussion. This is what I received:

Thanks for reaching out again. I have just spoken with the designers, and it turns out I was incorrect in my last message to you. I had thought skill shards worked the same way as talismans when they scale up, but I was incorrect.

When you use a skill shard that powers up a damage or healing, it's a little more complicated that just adding a few percentage points every time you place another shard. When 1 skill shard is applied, it multiples, and basically changes the base stat to a higher number. Every subsequent skill shard then multiplies off the new base stat.

Here's an example: Your base attack stat is 100. You add 1 skill shard that increases your attack stat by 5%. Your new base attack stat is now 105. If you then add a 2nd skill shard, this one increasing your attack stat by 10%, your stat now rises to 115.5 (105 x.1=10.5 , 10.5+105 = 115.5). If you were to add a 3rd skill shard that increases the attack stat by 20%, you are now at a base stat of 138.6.

When a skill shard increases something else (such as duration or effect chance), those are added to the value in the skill description, not multiplied. For example, an effect which lasts 2 turns and has "Effect Duration +1" and "Effect Duration +1" will make it last 4 turns (2+1+1=4). As another example, an effect which curses 45% of the time which as "Effect Chance +5%" and "Effect Chance +10%" would curse 60% of the time (45+5+10=60)

[Sparton_LOTB]

EDIT Haha, it looks like iPoop was getting the same message I was double checking with CS, so I'll edit out my part of the message that's basically the same as his.

(Fun fact: the game data has the multiplications for skill levels as integers, so stuff like 105 x 1.1 gets saved as 116; ie the rounding needs to be considered per skill level. Weird data structure stuff from before my time joining the project.)