Health Talismans: comparing overwhelming and mystical

[Peppoah]

Hi everybody,
This is the first thread I start in this forum and I hope it's for some use of the players.
I was recently searching for a right setup for Aces High Eddie and RttH Eddie
Their attack is very high and on the defense they're a bit low.
I wanted to go for what I call "classic" setup.
I didn't use RttH for the test, but Holy Smoke, because he's already fully sharded and I think they react similarly.
Aces high got two strength Safeguard, 2 Boost Will and 2 Health overwhelming.
Holy Smoke got 4 Strength Safeguard and 2 Health overwhelming.
I wanted to see how much their attack goes down, when I change one Health Talisman to Mystical to give them more MR.
I made the test in Blackened Pride, Madness level in Ailing Kingdom. (Thank you, Kardas, for giving me this Idea.)
Here are the results.

Holy Smoke- 2 overwhelming:

5088 Damage against red
2646 blue
6795 green

Holy Smoke- 1 overwhelming 1 Mystical:

4909 red
2553 blue
6557 green

So the difffence was:

-179 red
- 93 blue
-238 green

Next was the Aces High

2 overwhelming:

5915 red
3845 blue
5644 green

1 ow 1 myst:

5752 red
3739 blue
5488 green

Differences:

- 163 red
- 106 blue
- 156 green

So, now you can decide, if you want to do without this more attack and go for more attack or not.
I hope, I didn't bore you too much.
Maybe, I'll do the same with ward and overwhelming.

[Browno]

Nice one! I will definately try this myself. Maybe test how much damage on yourself is mitigated with mystical as well.

[Peppoah]

Thanks, Browno.
And thanks to Kardas,for giving me the idea to test in Blackened Pride.

[Kardas]

I just wanna say well done; this is cool stuff.

BTW, my reasons to head to Blackened Pride for this stuff is as follows:
- It's an easy level for endgamers, which is nice so you can bring an underlevelled Perfect Hit person for ease of checking damage.
- Only 3 waves unlike Shadow of the Wickerman.
- Only 3 classes to check. In fact, the Owl and Corrupt Owl Cultist seem to take identical damage! Same story with the two Ox Cultists.
- 4 SoT which is cheaper than 5 so you can test more.

[konstifik]

I just wanna say well done; this is cool stuff.

BTW, my reasons to head to Blackened Pride for this stuff is as follows:
- It's an easy level for endgamers, which is nice so you can bring an underlevelled Perfect Hit person for ease of checking damage.
- Only 3 waves unlike Shadow of the Wickerman.
- Only 3 classes to check. In fact, the Owl and Corrupt Owl Cultist seem to take identical damage! Same story with the two Ox Cultists.
- 4 SoT which is cheaper than 5 so you can test more.

There are only three waves in Shadow of the Wickerman (although there are four enemies in the first two waves).


OP: Thanks for sharing! No matter the class of the enemy, your HS Eddie dropped 3,5 % in damage and your AH Eddie dropped 2,75 % in damage. (Since your AH Eddie has a higher ATTACK stat than your HS Eddie with those talismans, the drop in ATTACK from the talisman switch is also higher for HS Eddie when seen as a percentage of the total.)

Also want to correct you in that Mystical doesn't give more DEF than Overwhelming, just more MR (for a lvl 50 talisman you switch 114 ATTACK for 114 MR, while HP and DEF are the same).

[Peppoah]

I did some new tests with health talismans. This time I compared ward and mystic instead of overwhelming

The toons I used were the Wickerman Eddie, PDK and the sentinel soldier as he's dealing with magic damage and is single attacker.
PDK and Ally have no skillshards, the Wickerman Eddie had 1 shard on his melt attack.

The Eddie had 4 Holy and 2 Health, the others had 4 Paladin and 2 Health.

The same test as before, I changed 1 Health from Ward to mystic to see how much the attack goes down.
Here are the results:
Wicker Eddie

11254 on the red enemy
4779 on the blue
5716 on the green


Next round 1 ward, 1 mystic

10967 red -287 means -2,55%
4779 blue -122 means -2,55%
5716 green -145 means -2,54%


PDK, first round 4 Paladin, 2 Health Ward

5965 red
2534+597 blue
3029 green

Next with 1 Ward, 1 Mystic

5760 red -205 means - 3,44%
2446+557 blue -128 means -4,09%
2925 green -104 means -3,44%

Sentinel allied soldier, 4 Paladin, 2 Health Ward

830x3 red
922x3 green
863x3 blue

1 Ward, 1 mystic

790x3 red -40x3 means -4,82%
879x3 green -43x3 means -4,66%
823x3 blue -40x3 means 4,63%

[Peppoah]

There are only three waves in Shadow of the Wickerman (although there are four enemies in the first two waves).


OP: Thanks for sharing! No matter the class of the enemy, your HS Eddie dropped 3,5 % in damage and your AH Eddie dropped 2,75 % in damage. (Since your AH Eddie has a higher ATTACK stat than your HS Eddie with those talismans, the drop in ATTACK from the talisman switch is also higher for HS Eddie when seen as a percentage of the total.)

Also want to correct you in that Mystical doesn't give more DEF than Overwhelming, just more MR (for a lvl 50 talisman you switch 114 ATTACK for 114 MR, while HP and DEF are the same).

Thank you, Johan,
You're right. I was thinking of defense in general, means def and mr. But as I wrote it, it's a bit confusing.
I changed it now.
It's interesting to count in percentage. Didn't think about it yet. It shows a different result.

[Sag7272]

I just wanna say well done; this is cool stuff.
BTW, my reasons to head to Blackened Pride for this stuff is as follows:
- It's an easy level for endgamers, which is nice so you can bring an underlevelled Perfect Hit person for ease of checking damage.
- Only 3 waves unlike Shadow of the Wickerman.
- Only 3 classes to check. In fact, the Owl and Corrupt Owl Cultist seem to take identical damage! Same story with the two Ox Cultists.
- 4 SoT which is cheaper than 5 so you can test more.

Won't jump in that conversation about mystical (great post btw) but Kardas, ain't it would be easier to "control test" in the arena's def manager... Easy to control who's in & adjust def/att/mag/mr at will
with tallisman you want both sides (bring a DM if you are lazy) best thing it's free of cost!

[Kardas]

Won't jump in that conversation about mystical (great post btw) but Kardas, ain't it would be easier to "control test" in the arena's def manager... Easy to control who's in & adjust def/att/mag/mr at will
with tallisman you want both sides (bring a DM if you are lazy) best thing it's free of cost!

Very true. A few things I would like to clarify though:
- I started with Blackened Pride testing before I started PVP (I started during Coming Home event, so that's not too long ago; weird I know)
- I'd be paranoid as hell about getting attacked while having my 'testing' defense out.
- Testing vs. defense makes it hard to reproduce results, do to the high chance of fighting vs. characters or Talismans that not everyone might have. Not as relevant as the other two perhaps, but the scientist in me likes my results to be falsifiable.

[Sag7272]

Very true. A few things I would like to clarify though:
- I started with Blackened Pride testing before I started PVP (I started during Coming Home event, so that's not too long ago; weird I know)
- I'd be paranoid as hell about getting attacked while having my 'testing' defense out.
- Testing vs. defense makes it hard to reproduce results, do to the high chance of fighting vs. characters or Talismans that not everyone might have. Not as relevant as the other two perhaps, but the scientist in me likes my results to be falsifiable.

I see, for your knowledge, as far as I know.. Defense isn't settled as long as you don't quit the manager, a bit like inventory, been tested a while ago wondering the same thing ;)