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Patrice-1201
08-06-2017, 05:32 PM
Troopers, I am just reading through the Eternal Soul
What did you get posts and a lot of us are angry at receiving dupes and this is not normal.

I would suggest that NF gives each of us the ability to swap one of our dupe Eternal for a non dupe.

My real issue is that PVP is 100% pay to win, it is not up to skills or toons it is up to dedication and kudos to all the strong contenders as it is a tedious thing to make it to the top 50 but without expensive ironites refills there is no contest.

Eternal Soul fragments are only available as PVP rewards and as such, being so hard to obtain dupes should not be happening point blank. Once the team of Eternal is complete then of course Eternals become sacrifice feeders in the hope of getting new characters or shards and that is fine.

It is extremely unfair and not customer friendly at all to apply RNG to something which you can only get by paying (or wait a year to complete).

If you agree and are willing to sign this petition please reply to this thread with your name in the comments.

Up the Irons.

druid138
08-06-2017, 06:00 PM
I would support this. Given the time and effort involved in obtaining Eternity Souls, they should have safeguards of some sort around the dupe issue. I think it's probably in NF's best interest to make a change, as the frustration among players will likely only grow as dupes become more frequent (just based on the math).

JJJ428
08-06-2017, 06:08 PM
As angry as I am about my 3rd clairvoyant and constant wanting of wrath or ever eternity eddie I don't think a petition is necessary. I think as long as the eternity souls aren't going away for awhile and I really hope they aren't. I am fine with getting dupes because eventually you will get all 4 and then what. They will still be offered as prizes for pvp every week which people will then complain about that and want something new but the people who haven't completed their 4th set will be upset they missed out. I think as long as there is no desire to discontinue the eternity souls and the two ways to get the fragments I am fine with the dupes even though I know i will curse seeing my 4th clairvoyant in 3 weeks.

kkkreg5
08-06-2017, 06:34 PM
I'm with Patrice on this.

JJJ, what if getting constant dupes creates stagnation in the quest for Eternals? What happens if players stop pursing Eternals because of the fear of dupes? For example, take me, I got my second Beelze after grinding for weeks to get the fragments only to be extremely disappointed, almost to the point of quitting the game. I feel others may begin to have the same feeling as I have and drop the quest for Eternals. I am no longer rabidly pursing fragments for Eternals. Maybe this causes NF to pull them. I don't know.

Another thought about players receiving their "wish list" of characters, how bad would that be? What if all players had the same characters to use? It would still come down to the individual. How would the characters be built? What team would I/you use in PVP? My point is, us as players would still have the control over our teams. Achieving Eternal status in PVP would still require putting in the time and effort. It would still come down to the individual player.

Jofer16
08-06-2017, 06:46 PM
I'm with Patrice on this.

JJJ, what if getting constant dupes creates stagnation in the quest for Eternals? What happens if players stop pursing Eternals because of the fear of dupes? For example, take me, I got my second Beelze after grinding for weeks to get the fragments only to be extremely disappointed, almost to the point of quitting the game. I feel others may begin to have the same feeling as I have and drop the quest for Eternals. I am no longer rabidly pursing fragments for Eternals. Maybe this causes NF to pull them. I don't know.

Another thought about players receiving their "wish list" of characters, how bad would that be? What if all players had the same characters to use? It would still come down to the individual. How would the characters be built? What team would I/you use in PVP? My point is, us as players would still have the control over our teams. Achieving Eternal status in PVP would still require putting in the time and effort. It would still come down to the individual player.

What if? It's already happening my friend. I said I'd quit because of this broke ass game if I got a 3rd Beezle. I opened my FOURTH the other day, that's right 4 Beezles. Until the devs get a clue of how to run a game, this won't change. And by the looks of things with all the broken balancing comments I see still today, coupled with complaints falling on deaf ears for the last 6 months, that clue remains elusive to them.

Petition signed,

Jofer16

Lulero
08-06-2017, 07:10 PM
I'm with JJJ on this.

@kkkreg5:
- People didn't need eternals to play competitively in PvP. Main drive are the skill shards, G/A souls and now essence from sacrificing what you get from eternal souls (unless no dupe, for once).
- You are right, you shouldn't pursue eternal souls that bad. They come for free once you can rank decently in arena, that's a reward from being dedicated.
- "What if all players had the same characters to use?" You can't be serious, or are you? That's what "stale" really means. I'd probably quit after a few weeks myself.

Don't expect anything, take what you get.
If you can score 40, 50 frags a week without much effort you will eventually have them all.
If you can't, work on it, eternals are supposed to be a reward not something granted right off the bat.

Mariner-1212
08-06-2017, 07:32 PM
I agree with both sides to a degree, but I think the solution is the one mentioned a week or two ago, to raise the sacrifice value of the eternals. If you could sacrifice one for 15,000 I'd take a dupe all day long.

@Lulero - you're in the minority in terms of fragments and PVP placement, I think. For those who don't pull 40-50 frags a week, it's a long grind to get duplicates. Anyone out of the top 100 will only pull between 5 and 10 fragments for the week (out of the top 250 only pulls 5). And right now, placing in the top 100 also costs you much of your Saturday... which is a lot to give up imo. So for most players, if you're buying the 20 frags each week + your 5 earned (laugh), you're looking at 6 weeks of saving up. Pull a dupe, and it's another 6 weeks (so now we're at 12 weeks ~ 3 months!)

To Lulero's other point, I do completely agree that the game would be stale if everyone had the same characters. And to your point about a reward for your dedication - I agree that for those of you who do consistently sit at that top, you definitely deserve to be rewarded. Maybe there's room for a different reward there - like if you finish in the top X spots, you're guaranteed a character that you don't already have.

Anyway, I don't know if NF would jump in and make it right in terms of past pulls, but I think raising the sacrifice value from now on is the way to go. Or, implement my 'character auction for ironite' idea, and you can sell your eternals to the highest bidder.

Kaz_LOTB
08-06-2017, 07:38 PM
Just as a heads up, we are indeed looking into a solution to ensure that after a certain number of Eternity Soul Summons, you will have the ability to get a specific Eternal you may be missing. It's still early in the design phase, but I'll be able to speak about it in more detail after the next few updates.

-Kaz

Patrice-1201
08-06-2017, 07:41 PM
Just as a heads up, we are indeed looking into a solution to ensure that after a certain number of Eternity Soul Summons, you will have the ability to get a specific Eternal you may be missing. It's still early in the design phase, but I'll be able to speak about it in more detail after the next few updates.

-Kaz

Well KAZ that means months away...

JJJ428
08-06-2017, 07:49 PM
But that also means eternity souls aren't going anywhere. I think its good for me to have a grind cause right now the number one reason i try to get top 50 every week is for the eternity souls once i get all 4 I doubt I would push as hard. Also I don't think it takes up that much time to get top 50 or 100 in pvp, top 10 or 25 sure its more work then I could ever put into it and congrats to guys who can do it week and week out or even just one week is impressive.

Jofer16
08-06-2017, 08:27 PM
I'm with JJJ on this.

@kkkreg5:
- People didn't need eternals to play competitively in PvP. Main drive are the skill shards, G/A souls and now essence from sacrificing what you get from eternal souls (unless no dupe, for once).
- You are right, you shouldn't pursue eternal souls that bad. They come for free once you can rank decently in arena, that's a reward from being dedicated.
- "What if all players had the same characters to use?" You can't be serious, or are you? That's what "stale" really means. I'd probably quit after a few weeks myself.

Don't expect anything, take what you get.
If you can score 40, 50 frags a week without much effort you will eventually have them all.
If you can't, work on it, eternals are supposed to be a reward not something granted right off the bat.

You're looking at it all wrong dude (or dudette). Of course we don't need these characters to beat you guys but it's just terrible game design for the majority of folks that grind these things out for weeks/months at a time. You a NF employee or what? lol. Not sure how this doesn't come as common sense.

Patrice-1201
08-06-2017, 08:32 PM
My real issue is that PVP is 100% pay to win, it is not up to skills or toons it is up to dedication and kudos to all the strong contenders as it is a tedious thing to make it to the top 50 but without expensive ironites refills there is no contest.

Eternal Soul fragments are only available as PVP rewards and as such, being so hard to obtain dupes should not be happening point blank. Once the team of Eternal is complete then of course Eternals become sacrifice feeders in the hope of getting new characters or shards and that is fine.

It is extremely unfair and not customer friendly at all to apply RNG to something which you can only get by paying (or wait a year to complete).

kkkreg5
08-06-2017, 08:56 PM
@kkkreg5:
- People didn't need eternals to play competitively in PvP. Main drive are the skill shards, G/A souls and now essence from sacrificing what you get from eternal souls (unless no dupe, for once).
- You are right, you shouldn't pursue eternal souls that bad. They come for free once you can rank decently in arena, that's a reward from being dedicated.
- "What if all players had the same characters to use?" You can't be serious, or are you? That's what "stale" really means. I'd probably quit after a few weeks myself.

Don't expect anything, take what you get.
If you can score 40, 50 frags a week without much effort you will eventually have them all.
If you can't, work on it, eternals are supposed to be a reward not something granted right off the bat.

Lulero,

...but I am serious.

Jofer is the perfect example here. Do you think that you could compete against Jofer if you had the same characters as him? Does anyone think they could? This is where your character building comes into play. Even if you were to build the characters, by chance, exactly the same as your competitor, who does it really come down to?

It is about dedication, I agree but I don't have the time, or the resources to compete at that level in PVP. That's why I don't try. Not many others do, it's just not possible in their/my life, but I'm not going to fret about it that. I've made that conscious decision. Their should not be Eternal dupes, period.

"Stale" is what the game is now. No new content. No new incentives. Players grinding the same worlds over and over is the epitome of "stale."

If I were to "take what I get", then this game is complete for me and I'm done. I finished the game. If the devs want me to continue to play. Then they have to give me reason to continue. Right now, they have not given me any.

Askora
08-06-2017, 09:18 PM
Any solution is likely to take time to implement. The good news is that they're working on doing just that. So, I'd say that at least on this they've listened and are responding. While it would be nice to have it right away, that's not a realistic expectation. Perhaps it'll be introduced with the update following BNW. That would likely be in 4 to 6 weeks after the upcoming update.

While it might be less fun at the moment, there is nothing forcing anyone to drop that eternal soul right away. For those not willing to take the chance of yet another dupe without some remedy, why not just wait?

Lulero
08-06-2017, 09:22 PM
I get the frustration bit. I really do. Not quite as much as JJJ and Jofer are entitled to given their bad draws but still missing my most wanted one.

Still, I do not believe "no dupe" is the solution there... I'm really curious (and worried) about what NF will come up with.

@Jofer:
Wasn't clear enough I guess, I meant you don't need the incentive from eternal fragments to play competitively.

@kkkreg5:
I have most of the characters Jofer has and don't even remotely try for #1, so no I'm not thinking that.
My drive is to complete my collection, my doom is that the day I do so I'll be left without a thing to look forward.
And I might be a fool, but I think the later goes for many players.
That being said, the game has issues. At the very least we all seem to agree PvP needs an overhaul and that PvE needs more content.

Patrice-1201
08-06-2017, 09:31 PM
Any solution is likely to take time to implement. The good news is that they're working on doing just that. So, I'd say that at least on this they've listened and are responding. While it would be nice to have it right away, that's not a realistic expectation. Perhaps it'll be introduced with the update following BNW. That would likely be in 4 to 6 weeks after the upcoming update.

While it might be less fun at the moment, there is nothing forcing anyone to drop that eternal soul right away. For those not willing to take the chance of yet another dupe without some remedy, why not just wait?


It can be impleystraight away through support. Each player sends his/her account with the the dupe and the request for replacement. It would Be such a great move from NF in terms of customer service.

Askora
08-06-2017, 09:41 PM
It can be impleystraight away through support. Each player sends his/her account with the the dupe and the request for replacement. It would Be such a great move from NF in terms of customer service.

True, but then it's not fair to those who may have sacrificed a dupe.

DaveMurray
08-07-2017, 09:08 AM
Petition signed.

And not only that but i was about to send that to support before i read the post. I don't know if i continue to play if they don't change a dupe at least, it is fucking ridiculous to get a dupe after a months grind.
I don't care what NF's defenders say this system sucks and drive players away and a solution in 2 months from now is just not enough for me, i already had many dupes, don't need a meter to fill of more dupes to get the toon that i want.
Last but not least, not needed for PvP? lol then ban the thousands of Wraths from PvP and see 9/10 of the players that got him quit the game at once because they can't even win a 10 lvl players..

MoonShadow
08-07-2017, 09:32 AM
Petition signed.

For the most reasons above, below and here (http://forum.ironmaidenlegacy.com/showthread.php?6020-Eternal-soul-what-did-you-get&p=53061&posted=1#post53061).

R1ck
08-07-2017, 01:26 PM
Petition signed, not because an eternal is needed to be competitive in PVP, just because there's a lot of people that plays arena not regularly and for those who can get a Eternal soul every 3 months would be real disappointing to get a dupe.

PerthEddie
08-07-2017, 01:44 PM
Signed. I have only been able to earn 2 Eternal souls so far and both have been Clairvoyants. Will probably take me another 4 weeks to get enough fragments for my 3rd and I am already nervous that it might be a 3rd Clairvoyant :(

Blacksteel
08-07-2017, 02:13 PM
Any solution is likely to take time to implement. The good news is that they're working on doing just that. So, I'd say that at least on this they've listened and are responding. While it would be nice to have it right away, that's not a realistic expectation. Perhaps it'll be introduced with the update following BNW. That would likely be in 4 to 6 weeks after the upcoming update.

While it might be less fun at the moment, there is nothing forcing anyone to drop that eternal soul right away. For those not willing to take the chance of yet another dupe without some remedy, why not just wait?

If they really wanted to they could have it ready very soon as it should be easy to add a basic limit rule for something like 'no more than 2 dups for regular eternal and no dup for eddie, when the set is complete then roll whatever', it's just an ordinary inventory check and maybe a comparison cycle with reroll for the dup, I am sure they have functions for this in their API already in place and test case is very simple on this one.
Then they can take their time to develop some UI/screen to select which character you want with bells and whistles, which seems something along the lines of what Taz mentioned, but in the meantime the community is happy.

Petition signed.

blade685
08-08-2017, 11:49 AM
i sign it!!! :cool:

Nicko
08-08-2017, 04:09 PM
This is an rng based game and dupes happen. I accept that.

But in a case like the Eternals - I agree there should be a limit. There's a lot of work involved getting one. One or two dupes? Ok - it happens.

Three or four frickin' Beelzebubs? That sucks - and just demotivates and pisses the player base off.

Petition signed - though Kaz said they're already on it ;)

HeadOnFire
08-08-2017, 04:17 PM
/SIGN PETITION!



My real issue is that PVP is 100% pay to win, it is not up to skills or toons it is up to dedication and kudos to all the strong contenders as it is a tedious thing to make it to the top 50 but without expensive ironites refills there is no contest.

Yes, THIS! I'm pretty sure most of the people in the top divisions are spending serious $$$'s on ironite to keep refreshing their attack list and refilling their sands of war. I've just recently managed to put together a strong enough team to claw my way out of the duelist division, but can rarely stay below rank 250. I've noticed that I keep getting attacked by people who are in the king and even eternal divisions, while I'm just barely on the threshold of warlord. I've had the same couple of king/eternal-ranked people break my defense, over and over. I don't retaliate against them from my defense list, they don't show up on my attack list, but they are able to attack me several times a day. I can only conclude that they refresh their lists so many times that they get to fight lower-ranked people for easy wins.

I guess I've gone a little off topic, since this thread was supposed to be about duplicate eternals, but the problems are intertwined. It would be better for almost everyone if we had a more fair matchmaking system.

HeadOnFire
08-08-2017, 04:19 PM
Another idea I had is that sacrificing eternals should return some eternity fragments. Not a lot, just maybe like 35-50. Something to soften the blow of several weeks of grinding getting tossed in the sacrifice pit.

The Educated fool
08-08-2017, 05:22 PM
Another idea I had is that sacrificing eternals should return some eternity fragments. Not a lot, just maybe like 35-50. Something to soften the blow of several weeks of grinding getting tossed in the sacrifice pit.

This is a really good idea. It would definitely help to lessen the sting of a dupe!

osiris0000
08-08-2017, 05:57 PM
Petition is signed.

Basically, it can be a simple solution like this:

Let us choose which Eternal we want, period.

Some players may want to build 3 Beelzebub team, some players may want to have all 4 first.
Let us free to choose what we want to do with those fragments.
It takes 3 weeks to get those characters in best performance (for top 50)
For majority it takes way much longer.

Yes, lot of players here are LotB crazy and having lot of patience and will to keep grinding,
But i don't think majority of players have the same patience and will to keep playing as much as we have.

As a long time player, i don't want to see LotB losing players because of not applying a simple solution.
Grinding 3 weeks for getting a dupe is a big disappointment for a regular player.

I look forward to see a good solution to this in short time, for the sake of the game!

slauki
08-08-2017, 07:08 PM
all in all the chances of 25% are pretty high to get the eternal you wish. it's way easier to get a specific eternal if you compare it with the prisoner or the cyborg. so the eternals will come, it's just a matter of time.
that's the theory aspect at least.

the problem with this is that most of us top players have to wait 3 and more weeks to get a shot. some have to wait 6+ weeks if they are low in the rankings. and imagine a situation where you have 3 eternals and missing only the last one. chances are 24% that you will get another dupe 5 times in a row, which is almost equal to the chances to get the last eternal!!! = 15-30 weeks of sheer frustration. (6% to get 10 dupes in a row = more than a year of frustration) .... who wouldn't quit under these circumstances...

Shaolin85london
08-08-2017, 08:08 PM
Petition signed. I got myself 3wrath, in a row. Now I'm scared to open the next eternity soul. Gonna wait till new eternity soul toons come over.

GotN
08-27-2017, 08:46 AM
Petition signed. Had 3 eternal souls so far and already one dupe Eternity Eddie. Can't be!!!

Sidney
08-27-2017, 02:26 PM
I've only opened 2 Eternity souls so far and I ended up with 2 Eternity Eddies. I wasn't too upset since he was good fodder for the sacrifice pit, but I'd like to see the duplicate issue remedied quickly. I went a few weeks of not claiming the weekly allotment of fragments because I just knew I'd pull another dupe, and I spent the Iron Coins on Shards and other fun stuff. Started claiming them again and I'm a week away from seeing what I end up with. I don't try and get to top 50 as I don't have that much free time so it takes me longer to earn the Eternal soul. Troopers come first and then whatever time I have left is just a bonus.

Thanks to all my troopers for the badges and I'll keep sending them your way!!

JJJ428
08-27-2017, 02:57 PM
Hoping we get more information about the no eternity dupe system they are working on. I am at 6 souls and only 2 eternals so far.

Silentknight
08-27-2017, 03:17 PM
Gawd this thread is pathetic! There's only 4 of em, ofc ur gunna get dupes! Everyone wants em all now! No dupe system should b applied 2 every other fuckin soul in the game tho, like legendary, the most expensive soul in the game! I mean what r the odds of 4 blue bats in a row? I'll tell ya...pretty damn good!

eddielucke
08-27-2017, 04:05 PM
I have Wrath Clairvoyany and Belzebu. I have opened my 4 eternal soul a a couple of weeks ago and i got another Clair. i have opened my 5 eternal soul today and i got another Wrath.

Enti
08-27-2017, 06:00 PM
Gawd this thread is pathetic! There's only 4 of em, ofc ur gunna get dupes! Everyone wants em all now! No dupe system should b applied 2 every other fuckin soul in the game tho, like legendary, the most expensive soul in the game! I mean what r the odds of 4 blue bats in a row? I'll tell ya...pretty damn good!

Couldn't have said better! Even the lowest possibility to open a new soul is 25%

Legendary pool is 59 characters... Eternal is 4

Accept and embrace that you have 75% of getting a dupe and 25% getting your last eternal. Geez

Ezz
08-27-2017, 06:11 PM
3 Beezl's in a row for me. I think it sux, but then again I got Wrath on my first pull so I don't really care. I would not mind having Claire or eternity Eddie but I can live without them, as I would not use them much anyhow.

I do agree with the idea of increasing the sacrifice values though. These are eternals and their essence should be valued accordingly.

Silentknight
08-27-2017, 08:26 PM
Couldn't have said better! Even the lowest possibility to open a new soul is 25%

Legendary pool is 59 characters... Eternal is 4

Accept and embrace that you have 75% of getting a dupe and 25% getting your last eternal. Geez

All but Beelz, then doubles of each. So now I'm saving & will open 5 of em.

Enti
08-27-2017, 08:29 PM
All but Beelz, then doubles of each. So now I'm saving & will open 5 of em.

Gonna get 5 Eternity Eddies x'D

Silentknight
08-27-2017, 09:10 PM
Gonna get 5 Eternity Eddies x'D

I'll take the essence & can always use a new phone,lol

kkkreg5
08-28-2017, 12:16 AM
3rd effing Beelze for me today. You can pull him out of the trash heap SK.

kkkreg5
08-28-2017, 12:17 AM
Couldn't have said better! Even the lowest possibility to open a new soul is 25%

Legendary pool is 59 characters... Eternal is 4

Accept and embrace that you have 75% of getting a dupe and 25% getting your last eternal. Geez

25% chance my ass. 75% chance of pulling a Beelze! Eff that!! Not worth the trouble...

Silentknight
08-28-2017, 02:02 AM
3rd effing Beelze for me today. You can pull him out of the trash heap SK.

Jofer got u beat by 1, conspiracy theories abound!!!

kkkreg5
08-28-2017, 02:39 AM
Jofer got u beat by 1, conspiracy theories abound!!!

No conspiracy theorists here. Jofer can have all he wants. He's a "robot" in PVP. I'm guessing you're not, or you would have had yours by now. Again, proving us "casual" player don't stand a chance.

Silentknight
08-28-2017, 03:12 AM
No conspiracy theorists here. Jofer can have all he wants. He's a "robot" in PVP. I'm guessing you're not, or you would have had yours by now. Again, proving us "casual" player don't stand a chance.
Think that's kinda the point of eternals, casual players should take a long time 2 get em all, that's what makes em special. I wouldn't consider myself hardcore as NF will never get a dime outta me but I'm also not casual as I rarely waste SoW, SoT or trooper badges. Have prolly 90-95% of all toons maxed incl. 1 & 2☆'s & 3 of 4 eternals. But I just got AoF & still have no Nomad, Red Buzz, Samurai, Tailgunner, Rainmaker or VHE +++. So 2 me, Eternals aren't the problem. Basically it's the whole RNG process. Kaz said they're working on something for eternal dupes so I just hope it applies to all toons & doesn't take 4ever!
Original point was there's players out there that have it worse!

blade685
08-30-2017, 10:49 AM
3rd clairvoyant.... for me never see belz ^^