What's a good defense percentage?

[Yup]

No one can have 100% defense in the arena.. so I'm curious.. what's a decent defense percentage? 20% 30% 40%? Any of the area top players want to share their DEF percent?

I'm hovering around 20-25% Seems 7S Eddie boosted it about 5% over Navigator.

[slauki]

if someone shares his 50% def all will copy it, so i wouldn't count on many replies...mine is at 2% right now for example :p

[Amarthir]

VHE and the 3 valkyries usually put my defense in the mid 20's, which I think is good enough. But I'm open to any better suggestions.

[slauki]

problem is it all depends on the ranks you are usually in. in the top 20 the % will be much lower than in top 2000. so it's really hard to compare stuff in a vacuum.

[Amarthir]

These days I only play in arena events so right now my points are around 1500 and my defense is in the 60%s if I actually tried and went up to Warlord it would be MUCH lower

[Yup]

if someone shares his 50% def all will copy it, so i wouldn't count on many replies...mine is at 2% right now for example :p

How can they copy it??? Sure they MIGHT be able to GUESS and who's on your def team. But it would be a complete guess unless you've had a battle. If you've battled them they might be able to write down the characters, then go search your user name (guessing at the random numbers added by the app to the username).... are people really that into something that is COMPLETE luck based upon characters everyone has? I mean.. it's not like everyone doesn't have access to the same talismans.

[bort]

I'm at 50% (20/39) now, but I have a feeling that I haven't been tested *too* much. I'm running 7SE on def.

[Yup]

Yeah, 39 D fights this week isn't much. I'm just over 100 D fights thus far this week. I figured an uptick due to 7S in Def and people wanting to test it.

Maybe you just scare off competitors. :) :D

[slauki]

How can they copy it??? Sure they MIGHT be able to GUESS and who's on your def team. But it would be a complete guess unless you've had a battle. If you've battled them they might be able to write down the characters, then go search your user name (guessing at the random numbers added by the app to the username).... are people really that into something that is COMPLETE luck based upon characters everyone has? I mean.. it's not like everyone doesn't have access to the same talismans.

the names are the same in the top region. it'S very easy to recognize the trend if you play every week. i could name you 10 guys with a superb defense and the talismans they have. and to be honest the defense of this meta so far is this:

7th son --- astra---- gcotd---- and red buzz. saw this defense very often among top 25 guys and i think we will see it even more once more people get 7th son.

the players tend to copy what they find hard to beat so you can see a trend very soon. it's really easy to copy something which is very common. i have the feeling that there were many more variations around last week. but the last update chenged this because they destroyed the hard archieved balance with the 7th son (and partly with the goctd). now we have to deal with this crap over and over till they squeezed out enough money so that they can change it.

to be fair i don't think the devs can do what they want, they have to follow orders. but in all honesty someone fucked this up real badly if you ask me. they are more focused on shortterm income, instead of longterm quality.

[Patrice-1201]

yeah very hard to hide a defence strategy indeed... on my main account with a strong team i usually sit between 20% and 25% in the top 50, on a secondary account with an ok team i sit on 60% but in 1500 points range...

One thing to mention is that i sacrificed all my GCOTD as soon as they showed up... starting to regret it badly now ;-)

[edsel]

4239

not a huge amount of traffic to show numbers? right away the team outlined in 7SE post was at 48% and still now right under 50

7th Son is better than Vampire

[90mphyorker]

I’m at 9% now.

But I’m bad at arena.

[blade685]

I’m at 9% now.

But I’m bad at arena.

if you don't have actual op characters you can't have a good % :)

[Yup]

Yeah it does take the right characters. Which is why I don't think there's that much "strategy" to it.

I sacrificed gCotD several times, thankfully I held onto the last one I got.... it is broke..... way, way over tuned.... but until it's fixed, there's not much to do but use it to your advantage since others are.

[blade685]

Yeah it does take the right characters. Which is why I don't think there's that much "strategy" to it.

I sacrificed gCotD several times, thankfully I held onto the last one I got.... it is broke..... way, way over tuned.... but until it's fixed, there's not much to do but use it to your advantage since others are.

and we ll lose 14 skill shard after nerf like others toons ;)

[Yup]

and we ll lose 14 skill shard after nerf like others toons ;)

Well I had it fully sharded anyway, before the tuning. I often skill shard non-Eddies first so the team as a whole is stronger. The only character I'll use in the arena NOT fully skill sharded is an Eddie. For example I still need 3 shards on my 7S... but he's kicking ass without them anyway. (And he'll have those three after the weekly turnover at the latest.)

[T-Man]

if you don't have actual op characters you can't have a good % :)

It helps, but if you don’t have VH, etc Pharaoh can do pretty well with the right team and set up. If he was a little smarter reviving he would do even better.

As to the main topic

30 finishing in the top 25 or even 50 is very good.
20 is ok.

[blade685]

It helps, but if you don’t have VH, etc Pharaoh can do pretty well with the right team and set up. If he was a little smarter reviving he would do even better.

As to the main topic

30 finishing in the top 25 or even 50 is very good.
20 is ok.

pharaoh in att yes ( i use it because i don't have VH or seventh) but in def VH is so much better :)

[Amarthir]

4239

not a huge amount of traffic to show numbers? right away the team outlined in 7SE post was at 48% and still now right under 50

7th Son is better than Vampire

It's a bit hard to say based on your position, numbers usually go down once you get into the Warlord sections and even further in the Kings, my defense team is getting over 60% and I'm in the Duelist III

[HomemLivre]

Yeah it does take the right characters. Which is why I don't think there's that much "strategy" to it.

Of course that if you want to build a good defense you need to think a LOT, its not simple as have the right chars.
But as Slauki said, if you do this people will copy you, and will copy HARD!

I remmember the day that I build the two sentinel hapies defense a long time ago and after I said the % in the forum the number of clone defenses of mine increased a lot, and even with a dude (a little hated here in the forum) bragging that "his" defense (a total copy of chars and talisman of mine) was awesome just trying to make Jofer says his %.

So, I can't add much more than Slauki already said.

[Yup]

I guess I'm just not that bothered if someone copies my defense. I mean it's only going to do them so much good. And really... I don't care to "rush to eternal" anyway. As long as I make my 1200 iron coins and finish above Duelist III for the fragments at the end of the week... I'm good.

[blade685]

I guess I'm just not that bothered if someone copies my defense. I mean it's only going to do them so much good. And really... I don't care to "rush to eternal" anyway. As long as I make my 1200 iron coins and finish above Duelist III for the fragments at the end of the week... I'm good.

same here and i spend too many time on the game only to be top 50 or 25
I will never use the time to be top 3 :rolleyes:
And with my characters never for sure :cool:

[HomemLivre]

I guess I'm just not that bothered if someone copies my defense. I mean it's only going to do them so much good. And really... I don't care to "rush to eternal" anyway. As long as I make my 1200 iron coins and finish above Duelist III for the fragments at the end of the week... I'm good.

Besides everything that Slauki said and that I said before, have the right chars don't make you have a good defense, only if you copy a hard thinking defense from someone with that same chars.

If you don't mind to copy someone defense you just need to have that chars in use, but if you want to build yours (or if you don't have the right chars to copy a defense) and have a good % you need to think hard, just saying.

[Yup]

And all I'm saying is everyone has access to the same characters and the same talismans. It's not as if you have that "special" version of an Immorality talisman that offers an extra +100 attack. It's all merely LUCK as to how the AI plays your team at a certain point.

Y'all act like Olympic Athletes that have been training for years... it's not some sort of skill contest.. it's a slot machine, with specific ways to improve your odds... not strategies to win anything. 99.9% of any sort of strategy is only in attacking, not the defense. When attacking you chose who hits who first, what ability is used next, etc. On defense, the AI rolls the dice.. the only aspect of strategy there is what is the AI offered as choices.

The only real defense strategy is to create a team people are afraid of so you don't get attacked.

[slauki]

Of course that if you want to build a good defense you need to think a LOT, its not simple as have the right chars.
But as Slauki said, if you do this people will copy you, and will copy HARD!

I remmember the day that I build the two sentinel hapies defense a long time ago and after I said the % in the forum the number of clone defenses of mine increased a lot, and even with a dude (a little hated here in the forum) bragging that "his" defense (a total copy of chars and talisman of mine) was awesome just trying to make Jofer says his %.

So, I can't add much more than Slauki already said.

that was a legendary defense buddy :D :D :D glad i had my red nobl as attacker back then. if they silence you in the wrong moment you are done, and they hit damn hard even without class advantage.


And all I'm saying is everyone has access to the same characters and the same talismans. It's not as if you have that "special" version of an Immorality talisman that offers an extra +100 attack. It's all merely LUCK as to how the AI plays your team at a certain point.

Y'all act like Olympic Athletes that have been training for years... it's not some sort of skill contest.. it's a slot machine, with specific ways to improve your odds... not strategies to win anything. 99.9% of any sort of strategy is only in attacking, not the defense. When attacking you chose who hits who first, what ability is used next, etc. On defense, the AI rolls the dice.. the only aspect of strategy there is what is the AI offered as choices.

The only real defense strategy is to create a team people are afraid of so you don't get attacked.

i partly disgree, let'S take nicko, kamuz and homem as example. all of them came up with new combos several times. nicko with his legendary two wraths and many more. kamuz is also a defense master in different variations, these guys spend a lot of times testing and they are always ahead of the masses. so it's more than only have char xyz, you have to have an idea on how to use them too.

but yeah they will be copied in a few days, so this game doesn't benefit you for being a defense mastermind for sure. and yeah the individual fight is like a slot machine every time, but you can improve your average winning% overall and that matters. so it's not random by definition since you have influence on it.

[HomemLivre]

And all I'm saying is everyone has access to the same characters and the same talismans. It's not as if you have that "special" version of an Immorality talisman that offers an extra +100 attack. It's all merely LUCK as to how the AI plays your team at a certain point.

Y'all act like Olympic Athletes that have been training for years... it's not some sort of skill contest.. it's a slot machine, with specific ways to improve your odds... not strategies to win anything. 99.9% of any sort of strategy is only in attacking, not the defense. When attacking you chose who hits who first, what ability is used next, etc. On defense, the AI rolls the dice.. the only aspect of strategy there is what is the AI offered as choices.

Don't get me wrong, dude, but build a defense is way more than you said. Just for fun, try to spend some dozens of hours building different defenses and see how they work, its something that makes the arena fun.
Your saying that we act like Olympic Athletes? hahaha, wth! Arena is a contest and have a good defense is part of this contest. Im totally out of the arena due to have no time to play and becouse Im the only one that have a phone unable to run the game so Im really out of your saying...

About have access to chars, your right and wrong about it. I have no Assassin Valk nor Nomad, so I build a team without any of them, many top players did not have nice chars for Arena, including Gmac and Caliza that never gets a Prisoner for exemple and many other that have no VHE. Access we all have, luck in other way...

So relax dude, Im just saying what happened to me a time ago and still happening with other players, and if you still thinking that some defense teams simply works becouse of the chars or whatever and a roll of the dice, ok, we all have our opinion. :p

[HomemLivre]

that was a legendary defense buddy :D :D :D glad i had my red nobl as attacker back then. if they silence you in the wrong moment you are done, and they hit damn hard even without class advantage.

Just like that recently 3 Echo of yours! hahahahah

I had luck when I faced you but not be able to play and be in lower ranks makes me not face awesome teams like yours (but some lower rank teams are awesome to and very creative!). Need to invest some more time to face harder teams and try dif attack combinations :p

[Bradata]

Anything above 20% is good, WHEN you are in the top 25.
What I usually do when I build a good defense is make sure I can beat it most of the time before I put it out in the open and other players start copying it. When I was once Eternal, I had 851 attacks on me and 236 holds, that took my defense to 28%. It is very hard to judge % from less than 200-300 attacks per week and lately no one goes that far. Good old times most of the top players had minimum 500-600 attacks on them and you can do the math how many times they attacked. For example, when I was attacked 851 times, I've attacked other players almost 1200 times.
And I still strongly disagree with the devs when they started showing what characters were used from your attacker on the defense page, this wiped off the little fun we had playing PVP and I think this is the reason for the slow PVP and absent players "taking brake".
So, back to your question. There never gonna be "best" defense team, just better attack tactics. As slauki showed in one of his posts: 99% offense, that is what you need :cool:

[HomemLivre]

i partly disgree, let'S take nicko, kamuz and homem as example. all of them came up with new combos several times. nicko with his legendary two wraths and many more. kamuz is also a defense master in different variations, these guys spend a lot of times testing and they are always ahead of the masses. so it's more than only have char xyz, you have to have an idea on how to use them too.

but yeah they will be copied in a few days, so this game doesn't benefit you for being a defense mastermind for sure. and yeah the individual fight is like a slot machine every time, but you can improve your average winning% overall and that matters. so it's not random by definition since you have influence on it.

Exactly what happen and why I said that I could not complement you more hahaha! You already said everything about this topic in your replys!



And I still strongly disagree with the devs when they started showing what characters were used from your attacker on the defense page, this wiped off the little fun we had playing PVP and I think this is the reason for the slow PVP and absent players "taking brake".
So, back to your question. There never gonna be "best" defense team, just better attack tactics. As slauki showed in one of his posts: 99% offense, that is what you need :cool:

Yep, thats another thing that makes top players step back and take it easy. I still don't understand why show attacker teams makes you build a good defense. I never needed to know that to build a defense.

[slauki]

And I still strongly disagree with the devs when they started showing what characters were used from your attacker on the defense page, this wiped off the little fun we had playing PVP and I think this is the reason for the slow PVP and absent players "taking brake".

NF did many questionable decisions, but this one was one of the worst PVP related decisions so far. you are prolly right about that being a reason for some guys to step down. i know that one legend steped back because of this. now the game doesn't reward you for good ideas on defense and not for good ideas on offense, since you spend hours and hours on creating a cool offense strategy and it can be stolen in seconds. and i cannot see how this will help the def. it would be really necessary to remove this stupid feature at least once you are in the top 100.

[Yup]

Please realize I'm smiling :) I'm not, like, upset or anything about this. Just conversation, that's all. My text can often be perceived as if I'm more adamant or animated than I really am. It wouldn't be unique of that's how I come across here :)

I agree it takes testing to find a good combination. And there's no 1 single setup that will work in all cases for everyone, so different characters in different combinations is a form of planning. But beyond that I just don't see it as strategy. Sometime the RNG grants you a favor, others it ridiculously robs you when it shouldn't. We've all been beaten by teams who should never have had a shot in hell of winning, but they do.

I too do a lot of testing.. but I also don't even bother testing a character unless it has all applied skill shards and max'ed out talismans, there's little point. No character of mine really even enters the arena without being full powered. So with that, I pick and choose which characters to power up since skill shards aren't overly common.

I will concede that it takes planning, but I wouldn't really call it "strategy" for defense. More just a guessing game and testing. And of course, if you have a set up that's beating others, people will try the same set up. It's just human nature.

This is what sparked this thread... different set ups and I was curious if everyone near the top was around the same 20-30% defense. I guess I just didn't think that merely because I would never just go and copy someone's set up without experimentation, testing, talisman testing etc, other's wouldn't either. People are people :) I guess some just slap the same 4 toons together and hope for the best. Whenever I do that, I find it's not really any better than when I test and plan myself.

And I will really never be trying to hit Eternal (not getting pulled into the Saturday rush unnecessarily) and anything above Duelist III I may hit, is just purely due to good characters, not overly repetitive play.

[Bradata]

We know what you meant, man! But we also know that devs are reading these posts and hoping that they get the point :eek:

[Sick]

Hi guys, I just wanted to share an experience I made this week, which somehow fits this thread. I flew to China last Monday and just returned today. Due to really poor network connections over there I could only play on a minimum level this week. Sorry troopers for not sending badges as usually, but one fight in Powerslave took more than five minutes.
However, I made sure to get all of my daily achievements. So I did one single arena fight each day. This morning I returned and played all the SoW I gathered this week. 25 fights in total. As I was on position 625 the opponents I got were quite easy to beat and I won most of my fights this morning (not all). The funny thing is that I won nearly all of my defense fights after that. I am now at 44% and on level #129. Maybe it does not make any sense to enter the arena before Saturday at all.