Printable View
We all can have or already have GR, just put a freeze set and you are done. It is not a rare char that noone can get. Sometimes you will start first and sometimes wont, it is pretty balanced. If you see at the top of the ranking there is not much diference in points between players, and many of those players use tailgunner, CR, SOL, so stop crying and please stop asking for another stupid nerf.
That's why you need a Hellhound or an Assassin Rocket Dog ... and make sure you are not playing against a Death Dog, Blue Bat or the Prisoner ...Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypnos
XcarecroW :)Quote:
Originally Posted by XcarecroW
To be honest I haven't seen ANYONE yet who would be put freeze ones to make him Grim Fridger Eddie ;) Rather his fury may be a bit unhandy, yet I HARDLY seen that anyone of Eddies can use the fury (except my own and Educated Fool SOL Eddie once - probably just because it was enough long fight to fill the fury meter)...
I've noticed the fact that I CAN loose a battle with opponent I've defeated many times before no matter hitting or waiting to be hit (and starting to repeat some patterns that I've practised before and it gave me the victory, yet sometimes AI CAN do someting unexpectable and then it is Houston... We have a problem LOL
Cheers,
W
Just by looking at your bio it's clear to me you lack an understanding of how balancing works. If you prefer a "whoever goes first wins" or "whoever gets lucky wins" type of PvP then fair enough. I imagine most of us would like a challenging and strategy based game mode where there isn't one template team that all the best players use.Quote:
Originally Posted by XcarecroW
I support the dev's nerfing characters as it improves the longevity of the game. Had the corrupt general, assassin golden son and Angel of fear not been nerfed to compete in PvP, most players, I included, would have given up by now. That said, I love the game and what the devs are doing with it but if they want long term players to stay interested, they know they have to make sure it doesn't become a template team driven game.
Well, my oppinion about pvp so far. I was with high expectations about it, and I am completly disapointed. There is 2 situations the repeat too often: first is the player who got the first turn, have 90% chance to win the battle. And second, Legacy of the Beast has talismans and skills that not match in a pvp type game, freeze, 2nd turn, that infinite titan shield of bnw new character... its completly non balanced, and combined with the player who will move first, it's insane. Most battles least 2 or 3 turns, and often the turns are consecutive because angel of fear passive or freeze status, and you can't call that and strategy game, or even a fun game. This is the type of thing I think the devs should have though before launch the beta!
To fix pvp, i think some major changes should be made. I don't know why 4 character, it's too much! Three at max, maybe 2, it will be interesting. Four characters in party plus skills like freeze or extra turn abilities are way too overpowered. Or maybe a diferent battle system, where the character do this action not all of them per turn, but the player chooses one of the to perform an action, and then pass the turn to the other player? Or maybe an different type of runes that prevents disable abilities, because its just annoying must have hellround just because of its passive.
About the defense system, prizings, ranking and rewars I think its almost ok. Its a little basic yet, a think the battles sugested are only designed by players level, what is kind of non balanced, while the player level is not that relevant... and maybe you should lose less points when you lose a battle, that will be cool.
Well, for now this is my thougs. Hope this helps a little!
I'd say for defence that is the case, but if you are on the 'attack', then going 2nd isnt only 10% chance to win. Sometimes, against a good team, you lose, but usually there is a work around against a team attacking 1st still. More time in PvP you will find tricks with your team to get around tough chars (like red troll). Unlucky getting frozen or stunned is probably the biggest challenge to beat if you go 2nd.Quote:
Originally Posted by StormArrow
Hi everyone.
I've been playing PvP this week, and I'm really enjoying it.
But today something that looks strange to me happened. I started a fight against the defending team of the player Mizrael. He got the first round attacking. So the first to attack was an assassin SoG, then his CG used the FURY attack, what I thought is very strange. With his fury one char of mine died, then he got another round, because the red bat on his team. And guess what ? His CG used a fury attack again. WTF, two furys attacks right in the first round, the second move.
Is it possible, it's a bug or its a cheater ???
Really want to know...
Sorry the bad english.
About the GR Eddie and Freeze Talismans.. Both GR Eddie and Freeze Talismans get nerfed already and i believe further neft about this 2 can hurt the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypnos
GR Eddie's basic attack's Reset trigger chance is already lowered.
Freeze set have a chance of %12 (Nerfed pretty hard from %35)
Since all of the GR's basic moves are multiple hit attacks, of course we should see a better chance to see talisman effect triggers- which same as all multiple hit chars in the game.
On the other hand, most of us are end-gamers & top-tier players here in this forum. Most of us already forgot how we were doing as a new-player in this game months ago. If a new player wants a GR Eddie with at least 1 Freeze Talisman set, here is what player must sacrifice to get it:
-Player must collect all 255 skulls to obtain Grim Reaper Eddie. This is like a LOTB degree diploma and reward for hard efforts of player. GR Eddie should stay some kind of special like he is currently. I don't think people will be happy to see a nerf especially on GR Eddie. This can easily hurt newbie's motivation to move forward in the game.
-Player must have Maxed 6 talisman set for GR Eddie's survivability on PVP (Even with maxed ones, he is not so tanky and dies easily), and we all know how much effort a player need to put for maxing the talismans nowadays, due to less rune drops. We are all missing good old rune raining days.
-Player must put at least 1 Freeze Talisman set. Which means sacrificing 3 talisman slots and having 2 talisman set effect for getting %12 trigger chance, instead of putting 3 talisman sets for some additional decent magic damage with Holy & Paladin or a Health Ward sets for more survivability.
-This effect triggers when player hits "Perfect" only.
With putting all this efforts, it is completely looks fair to me, that hard-gaming player can have some advantage than others. This sacrifices take long time. Because as far as i know, GR Eddie don't drop from rare or legendary souls. So no one can spam the game with buying rare souls to obtain him, they should spend some-time to be a good player and this is the reward of it.
And about the revenge, i agree with you. It's like an endless loop. I guess we need some algorithms about that. I choose to keep fighting back with players who attacked me, so i don't attract more attackers and lose more points. Because we have no control on AI when it comes to defence, works sooo random.
I had someone go back and forth with me ten times today. I finally said screw it. Even I - the revenge king - have my limits - just crazy!Quote:
Originally Posted by osiris0000
Hi,Quote:
Originally Posted by osiris0000
my main issue with this combo of GR + freeze is that in the top tier, defense teams really stand no chance. That is unless you have a Hellhound, which is easily countered by a character with Siege. I know this because GR is mostly the character that carries my team. If I get first turn against the enemy's defense team then I am at an extraordinary advantage and have won most of my games mainly because of this.
It really is no wonder most of the big players use GR and that my defense rarely "holds" against these teams.
I see what you mean about nerfing one of the most sought for characters in the game and it wouldn't make much sense now that I think about it. Not sure what could be done but I think it's not very fair that whenever I wake up, I see a whole list of "defense broken" just because I don't have the prisoner or corrupt general.
I've won most of my games too and until today had barely even touched GR after I first got him. Today I was rotating between GR, CR, and Viking; just lost to Osiris with GR but then revisited with Viking and kicked his arse!Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypnos
Point being there are lots of great characters in this game and it really is a combo of luck and strategy.
I think most of your wins going first are more due to the limitations of an AI defense as opposed to an overpowered GR, but that's just my opinion.
PVP would be more interesting if we were able to set defence AI, since we have no control. Even if you have very very solid defence, you cannot easily see "Held" on your defence against top-tier players. My current defence holds attacks around %20 & %30 approximately. Maximum %40 of the time for me (unless a stubborn attacker get lost to my defence all the time), no matter which team i put to defence. But some teams does better, i am just testing different defence synergies. But on the attack, i start to win %99 of the time even i got the first turn or not - by using best synergy i have with a killer team. I guess the secret is keep winning to the top, it is quite hard to stay on top when you can't control your defence effectively. So you can't rely on your defence only, you must keep fighting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicko
And we are only able to see last 10 attacks we got from defence, thats another thing. I was going to kick ass back after reading this Nicko, but my attacker list was too long, i will catch you after hehe :cool: Well, we are just kicking eachother on top 100 nowadays, because i know when i play against a forum player, i know that player can break my defence %80 of the time. But when PVP goes worldwide we will see more clear how amateurs & pros doing on our defence tab.
I had 5 sands of War, I started a new battle, the game crashed and now I have 0 sands of war, so I can't play the Arena and lost 5 chances
that's a visual glich, i had yesterday 10SOW for about an hour, so i tried to play as much as possible, but it crashed after i burned my "real" SOW i and after a restart it was at 0 as it should be.Quote:
Originally Posted by Derthona13
One question for the highrollers:
do you get 8 coins per match once you reach the status warlord for 2100 trophies? i saw that the coins jumped from 6 to 7 when you reach duelist, so i thought it might jump to 8 when reaching the new status.... and maybe 9 when reaching king and 10 when reaching eternal?
There should be a limit for revenge. Today a guy came back to me 5 times....and it's not ove yet. What's the Point? He beats me and I beat him in a never ending loop
I can't quite decide if I hate PvP or just think it's decidedly average.
another suggestion: add more characters with immunity for the whole party and with removing passives as i mentioned it before.
the freezes, stuns and taunts are probably a little too powerfull, and in some cases it's more gambling than playing strategicly. sparton with his two sentinel demons knows that :P
some people who has one of the 2-4 specific characters are in an unfair advantage, because it's hard/impossible to counter the abilitys. that's very imbalanced IMO.
BTW:
1500 trophies = 7 coins per battle
1900 trophies = 8 coins per battle
no idea if 2300 = 9 coins and so on?
Second this... With today's so far 20/25 second turns when I attack/revenge (it's not even bad luck, it's just unfair) it would really be fair to have some leverage against CG's, freeze sets etc... I don't like to whine in general, but this is pure OP you devs are trying to cut ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by slauki
Yup - and 9 at 2200, so imagine 10 at 2300Quote:
Originally Posted by slauki
Right now only Kaijester would know that for sure ;)
At 2300 you'll receive 12 iron coins per win.
hey killhouse welcome to the forums and ty you and nicko for answering :-)Quote:
Originally Posted by Killhouse
I recongnized one small problem:
when you have dupes they sometimes change places, for nop reason. so i used an unequipped pharaoh instead on my fully sharded and so i lost vs killhouse :)
so maybe you can allow us to put a lock to the characters or maybe let us swich their order, since there is not so much struckture in the character list anyway.
I feel like you should be given some sort of reward for defeating all 10 players on the attack list. Maybe some ironite or even sands of war.
We shouldn't gain or lose points for defense. It's AI controlled, it's not fair to gain or lose based on a roll of a dice.
My AI team sometimes can win a very high attack team if it uses the moves and perfect hits I intend them to use, but can be facerolled byt a very low team if it just don't hit perfect or use wrong skills.
IMO defense must be used just as a mean to player self esteem, not for rank. Also revenge should not reward/punish either.
Some days I spend more time revenging than attacking.
Great idea - the same thing happened to me with my Viking! Put the unleveled, untalismaned guy in and we all can guess how that went :)Quote:
Originally Posted by slauki
Killhouse - welcome - you've been rocking it today!
The fight for the first place is thrilling! Who'll get the Legendary Soul?
:D
Killhouse no doubt
I'm conceding! And was more interested in a second skill shard but too much work!
We'll see if Kaijester decides to give him a run for his money :)
I wouldn't mind settling for the Warlord I tier. I have a feeling it's gonna be tough in the dying moments!
Once over 2300 every win gives 12 Iron coins. Even if you're not going to catch a gunner like Killhouse, it still "pays" better than the lower ranks by a good margin. Once the store is in "full swing" it will be interesting to see how valuable these coins really are; right now they limit the quantity and Other than a 1x/week skillshard I'm saving my coins to see what the future holds
It will be interesting to see if in the final hours anyone makes a mad dash for the top. Christmas Eve may put a hamper on that...
Thank you Mr killhouse for attacking two times in 10 Minutes a guy with half your points....
Killhouse playing like he has unlimited Ironites...Quote:
Originally Posted by Derthona13
The problem is you have to clear every name on the list or you lose your statistical advantage, and the same names come up over an overQuote:
Originally Posted by Derthona13
Before Killhouse went on his mad dash I was doing the same. Poor Osiris, Optic Sugar, and Flying V are going to think I had personal vendettas against them, but right now that's how they have the game set up
Nothing personal!
Hmmm Killhouse gotten 800+ points in a matter of few hours. So if his Ironites is really unlimited he could be rank 1 weekly even if he is reset to 1000points...
great. Missed out on 3 rare souls and 20 more ironite because miklos knocked me out of the Warlord I tier with 6 seconds left.
So this should be good - the week ended and the revenges came out - they were waiting :)
Amazingly my defense held off the first three; but poor Killhouse will likely be getting a massive assault...
I'm sure it wasn't intentional - but that sucksQuote:
Originally Posted by Hypnos
This is not good..killhouse reset to 1885 points...he can be rank 1 weekly.
If he has the Ironite - and more importantly the patience and time - more power to him!Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaijester
He was a beast, and if he keeps that up every Saturday I think he'll burn out. But maybe not :p
Congrats Killhouse!
How does the reset work? This was my first week in the Arena, and in a matter of minutes i lost something like 300 points after the end of the week...how the number of lost points is decided?
No problem my friend, i don't think that way :cool: I just joined PVP this week, kept myself cool checking around. What i see on PVP, ironite is a must have to stay on top. I get so many attacks from Killhouse also. And having powerful defense as much as possible, sometimes even 10 points are important in the rush hour. So defence break of %70 is better than %80. This is a math in the end. :cool: I will just keep myself cool for collecting some ironite, building better debuffer defence team for a while.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicko
Hello to you all. I've been a long time lurker using the valuable information others have contributed here. Thank you to those members.
Before we go any further, I apologize to any that I attacked multiple times. Nothing personal, but with the random 10 targets to fight, we're at the mercy of the RNG that decides who we can face.
Early this week I tried climbing the ladder to see how hard it would be. Each night I'd be able to climb maybe 200 points just to lose over half of them to revenges while sleeping. Instead, knowing I had a large chunk of time the afternoon of reset, I went for it.
100's of ironite was spent (no it's not limitless but I had been sitting on a large stockpile) and even more time was spent than I care to admit. Was it worth it? No probably not, but I won't know for sure until I pop the souls. Still not ready to face the disappointment of another legendary soul or more gunner/assassin ones giving a duplicate or not so great character.
Thoughts I've had on the PVP beta:
Revenge, needs some limitations. I spent an entire nights worth of sand trading wins with some people, (Max and Mammy come to mind) where we were each too stubborn to cut the losses and move on. Eventually someone (me) would lose and end the cycle. There needs to be a limitation to how many times you can trade. I'd be happy with a system where you could only revenge once and if you win, you'd get some or all of your points back and none would be deducted from the other player (or maybe only half).
Strategy, at first it felt like there was a lot to consider but now I feel much like you just need to have the right skills and luck to give you the best odds of winning. Far too many fights depend on a) who goes first and b) whose talismans decide the fight. Too much luck goes into deciding the outcome of the fights.
Skills, as others have mentioned already, some skills are much better than others. There were plenty of combinations that I chose to ignore and spend ironite to refresh my opponent list rather than fight and watch my team get crushed. This surely contributed to some frustration of multiple attacks in a short time... I would try to avoid names I remembered but the lists just kept populating mostly the same names.
Passive skills to use:
First Blood, Siege (if you aren't lucky enough to have a prisoner for passive aggression), shield.
With these you can start with a huge advantage of having a shield for the first round and 2x turns of you can manage to get the first kill. Very few fights even last 2 rounds
Teams to avoid:
Teams with a prisoner, some are easier to manage but certain combinations of passive will crush you
Teams with a focus character, these tend to have a CG and at least one other with talismans on hit
For any wondering my typical attack team was:
Warrior Angel of Fear (Bat)
Warrior Troll
Magus Angel of Pain (Bat)
Sentinel Undead rescuer (strand is ridiculously useful)
Carriage Rider Eddie
If the team had tough passives, use the Angel of Pain to counter. If not, use the rescuer with freeze talismans to help swing luck in your favour.
Well, thanks for reading if you got this far and another apology to any that were attacked repeatedly on my mission... nothing personal and please take your revenges upon me!
Happy Holidays!