Community PVP/Arena general tips & Strategy Thread.

Since the dev’s tips are currently limited to briefly saying which talismans work well on certain characters and which allies a featured character works well with, this thread could be to share ideas and strategies we have found in more detail.

A few things we could discuss are:

Which ally(s) is a character naturally better teamed with? Naturally meaning only due to their abilities before talismans are taken into account.

Which enemies is this character naturally better against and why?

Which are they weaker against and why?

Which talismans work well on them and why?

The ‘why’ is important since the logic behind a decision will help others decide if it will work for them if they don’t have the exact same setup. I will contribute some ideas of my own as well.

So....
I did not seem like a great team for the defense, but I saw this combo doing a great attack this week.

Benjamin Breeg, with Energy / Warlod, his present power ability causes perfect corruption, his two abilities of the past heal, and basic, attacks all enemies. These cures give the boost to the talisman warlord. In addition, your Fury moves, ensures perfect health and perfect immunity.
Start using the basic ability of the past to ensure some power and healing, then ...

The Alchemist, with Angel and Warlord talismãs, if you get the power, use the alchemist's power ability and see only the destruction that happens, plus more healing, more buff for the warlord, and maybe even another turn for Eddie.

To complete the team, I was using the Assassin Hellraiser with Eternals, great character, remove effects, including golden ones (I usually clean with it before using eddie and the alchemist, if necessary, depends on the team you face). Although his power ability to be good, I did not use much.
And to close, I put Charlotte, with the talismans of domination and immunity, (plus a green talisman to increase her life), whenever a Counter-strike, or revenge were on the enemy team, I used it to steal the effect, and more healing.
Very good her power ability that can revive someone, the more support for Eddie's fury, and sometimes you have only Charlotte and with her you put ontime all around for kicking.

Basically this, I do not know if I was clear enough, please forgive some wrong term referring to the game.
Obviously it was not an unbeatable team, a lot of quick matches, because of all the talisman warlord buffs and the character cures, but many with Madame and Killler Prime got me a job

I spent 15minutes fighting a lone Charlotte with Domination set this weekend. A great combo really.

I am also liking Killer Prime with Nightmare. I paired him with Phantom but they kept overlapping Perfect Sleep so he may be better running it solo and have him as your last in line hitter. I had thought there was an ally or talisman that did more damage if the enemy had Permadeath on them but all I could find was Sentinel Chopper and his damage is pretty weak.

I have also been testing Cannoneer with Warlord and Mimic. Though the Physical Charge effect is still broken, he still hits pretty hard and often times gets an extra turn since his basic attack heals himself.

Great thread start Woody. Let’s keep it going.

really good initiative.

I find it interesting to share some thoughts about what to do in the Arena, how to face certain combos with the most appropriate team and everything.

And it looks like you Stormseye, found a great combination of talismans for Killer Prime. This character is doing a lot of damage out there nowadays.

I still can not think of a significant change for my defense ... I think now I'll wait for Madam and Killer Prime.

I have eat a little crow as I had been a proponent of the belief that "Alexander Eddie is a Novelty" but I have since changed that ideal after discovering how brutal he can be with some of the new talisman sets. Particularly Domination and Warlord. Using the same formulae for Killer Prime, I have two very heavy hitters coupled with the usual blocker and cleanser. I ran a weak defense up until Wednesday night and started at rank 80 and have since climbed into the top 10 using this team.

Alexander-Domination/Warlord/Warp(yea I use Warp, don't like it? Alex and 300k damage don't care)
Killer Prime - Immunity/Warlord/Sustaining
Magus Lillith- Sustaining/Destiny
Alchemist - Angel/Immortality


Here are some more common combination characters:-


Piece of Mind Eddie - Arguably the best all around Eddie in the game. One thing to note is that the AI will 90% of the time kill a Destiny Magus Lillith if the AI goes first. This is usually done with Disturbance or Sedate on occasion. Your team needs to either be lucky or have enough defense up on the first round to not lose any members against this first attack. His Fury speaks for itself and can level the field in one move. One of his newest perks is that Disturbance is hugely successful against Killer Prime whose passive will trigger the Trap and usually stun Killer Prime for the round unless cleansed. Frenzy is my main attack though after all other members of my team have gone, you have a chance to go again and it removes Endure.

Madam - She not only has a great basic attack which can remove all blue beneficial effects EVEN if the opponent has Perfect Immunity, her passive prevents Critical Strike and Physical Charge which are the bread and butter of Killer Prime and Warlord Talisman builds. She works great with Destiny (to provide damage mitigation) and Sustaining (again to provide heals for Warlord Talismans). She also can carry Oracle talismans which are highly underrated.

Killer Prime - If you have faced him then you know he is a monster. His passive alone makes him worthy of a spot in your build. Coupled with Warlord Talismans his damage sky rockets. What is interesting about him is that most of the high end players tend to run 3 2-set talismans as opposed to the more common 2 3-set. I run Immunity/Sustaining/Warlord on mine. I can easily hit for combined 100k against all opponents when his beneficial effects are stacked from all the healing. Due to this combination of talismans he is weak to negative effects without a cleanser and if block beneficial effects is in place his damage is severely crippled.

Charlotte - "The hard-hearted-harbinger-of-haggis" She lacks nothing in terms of damage and utility. Equipped with Echo and Advantage plus a passive that stalls even the hardiest of attacks, she brings so much to the battle. Permadeath is her only real weakness. The AI knows just when to use her power move and you will find yourself facing off against a full team of revived and invincible opponents again. Though Echo is her standard set up, I have to say with Domination talismans she can be a real lifesaver for you.

Ichiyou, Shinobi Medic - Another "under the radar" ally who has shown great utility in the arena. Able to wear Destiny and Sustaining talismans, her constant stun can be a real issue if the opponent has no cleanser. In addition if PoM/DDE has freshly cleared the board her basic attack will afford your whole team invincibility for the round.

There are still lots of allies that have recently been introduced but there are many more established allies that have a great potential to bring some new synergies to the Arena. We just have to keep finding them. I think this thread could really help other players get to those higher ranks in the Arena if we share what we know. We battle against an AI not another player. The player input is knowing what the AI will do with a particular character. If you are looking to build an awesome defense with 50% hold rate, I can't help really since mine gets beat all the time. Most of my feedback is designed to be used against that AI. Some can be used on the defense side but I think most people want information on how to beat the AI using certain builds.

Thanks for the great information and insight Stormseye. I don't have Killer Prime yet so I can't try your advice out with him but I will have to invest in leveling up some of my talisman sets so I can play with some of your suggestions. I wish you had written this a week or so ago as I have hit a brick wall against a team in Gauntlet on SS that is comprised of POM Eddie, Killer Prime, Ichiyou, and Mushashi. Nothing I threw at them made a dent. Oh well, there is always next Gauntlet season lol.

Nice work Stormseye, that's even good help for more senior players too!

You have covered in your character description 3/4 characters I currently run.
I have not got Killer Prime and yes he is devestating, but a good second best character is the Banchy, I don't see her used in Arena enough, I have a strategy I use against the still common HE/MLillith/Alchemist/Sekhmet or Prisoner builds.

It doesn't matter terribly who goes first, AI allows MLillith immunity first go round 75% of the time in my experience, I use Charlotte with the same talisman as Stormseye has suggested, I use her basic move to steal MLilliths immunity, then I use Banchy's basic to place perfect corruption on MLillith, this negative buff is not as good as Passive disable but it gets the job done, once MLillith has PC on her use POM's basic sedate, one punch is normally enough to kill MLillith first go round.

Even if HE revives her the destiny effects are broken and she's an easy kill from that point on, alternatively POM's Frenzy I find good as he attacks the whole team and if POM is fitted with Energy talisman you multiply the chance of collecting power 4 X.
Allowing Ichiyou a power move followed by another go after that, it is quite possible to take out MLillith and Alchemist in one turn...

Nice post Stormseye. The information given is impressive in the knowledge and the reasoning behind the talis picks.it shows you gave plenty of thought and time into the post.

What would be real beneficial to most of us is how to defeat the hard, duplicate teams in gauntlet with under utilized toons, to keep from using all the OPs up in the opening rounds. What are some of the lowly toons that we overlook, but can be used by equipping with the appropriate talis. Such as the last 2 events in SS, we battled 3 HE, M Lilith, Alchemist combos.

Is there any information about how much defense or MR stats reduce damage taken?

My typical arena build usually consists of

Piece of Mind or Benjamin Breeg Eddie: I'm conflicted about both since they're both incredibly useful but with Bennie I use Venom and Guard Talismans (Venom work too good with him) and with Piece of Mind I use Onslaught Angel and Mystical Sacrificial. Yeah that's a ton of health and defense right off the bat and believe me, his damage does not suffer.

Killer Prime: Total monster with Warlord and Sustaining like everyone says. I use prime Talismans for extra Perfect Immunity among my team

Madam: Oracle Talismans are always going to be what I use for her due to the combined MASSIVE heal across my team.

Charlotte: I found that using Redemption and Immunity is a good pair for her. Immunity keeps her passive from being disabled so those pesky Primordial Prisoners are a non issue since she makes the team immune to silver effects.

My 2 favorite parts about this team are the large amounts of buff removal (due to Killer Prime, Redemption and Madam) and the x4 health buff from Charlotte and Oracle Talismans. Turns out that health buff and Perfect Health do indeed stack so you can start the fight with a massive health boost.

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Originally Posted by Muzzleloader

Nice post Stormseye. The information given is impressive in the knowledge and the reasoning behind the talis picks.it shows you gave plenty of thought and time into the post.

What would be real beneficial to most of us is how to defeat the hard, duplicate teams in gauntlet with under utilized toons, to keep from using all the OPs up in the opening rounds. What are some of the lowly toons that we overlook, but can be used by equipping with the appropriate talis. Such as the last 2 events in SS, we battled 3 HE, M Lilith, Alchemist combos.

Is there any information about how much defense or MR stats reduce damage taken?

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I took your advise and started searching for some older allies that can contend with these new powerhouses. The current build I have can be pieced out or played together as they each prove themselves viable in the current game state.

Benjamin Breeg - He has some great utility against Magus Lilith with Nightmares and his Revive and Grave Digger can protect you against Killer Prime’s passive. I run him with Angel and Energy. Vile’s extra turn effect will trigger often and each perfect hit will have a chance to drain power and bloster your side.
You could use Purge as well to help remove opponent beneficial effects. I use Angel because I have no cleanser in this builld.

Astra, Valkyrie Slayer - Her passive, Obstruct, prevents Curse, Doom and Mark for all allies. This puts Killer Prime into a much more manageable state since most of his damage is amplified by Curse from his passive. Her basic attack, while weak in damage, is great because it deals 3 hits to all enemies with a 25% chance to remove a benefcial effect on each HIT and stuns the target if an effect is removed. Even if the opponent has an Alchemist the AI will be forced to use it’s turn to cleanse instead of the standard Last Rites and/or Strange Alchemy. If they have no cleanse like some lf the new power damage builds, they can be locked that turn. I run with Angel and Venom. There may have been a tweak to Venom talismans as they have been performing a little better. The damage is still low but I do see more negative effects landing on enemies. Nightmare talismans would work well on her too but I do too many attacks with Benji to make that effect justified in this build. I also use Angel talismans, again for the lack of a cleanser in the build.

Icarus - though he has faded a bit from the top end, he still can be utiilzed effectively. For me he is a Destiny carrier. Damage is so overwhelming in the current high end Arena and Guantlet. You really need to have a blocker or some sort of shielding or mitigation. He can heal and land some serious burns which translate to big damage (see below). If the enemy has no Immunity, then Icarus can steal effects better and anyone else. I have Shell only because I don’t have a spare set of Sustaining to give him though that is his ideal setup for this build. You can certainly change that in Gauntlet.

Sentinel Desert Maurauder - I am sure Rags and Edsel are rolling their eyes since I preach about this ally constantly but he really is that good. Firstly he is a blocker which is always beneficial for directing damage. His basic attack is where he really shines for me. Against Magis Lillith or any blocker, he sets the round. If they have no Immunity you can Diasble Passive on them and deal damage directly to the other opponents. If they have Immunity you can try and remove it with Benji (Nightmares) or Astra (Synthesis). If you start the round against Charlotte and you hit her with his basic attack the whole team loses the Perfect Health and Immunity from her, leaving them a bit softer.

Secondly his base damage is nothing special but his addtional true damage can hit some high numbers. He really can capitalize on all the Magic Burns from Icarus even if the enemy has sheilds. I have recently hit for an extra 6 hits of 15k each.

Thirdly, while his Blocker passive is a positive, he cannot wear Destiny talismans so his only shielding is what he can wear with 3 green and 3 open slots. Enter Eternity talismans. My set is Overwhelming and thus does nothing to improve his base damage, the overall protection this set gives all allies is well worth the sacrifice. Not only does the Marauder get a random damage shield, he also gets either Immortality or Endure every turn. Hopefully they will release a Magic based set but who knows.

Benjamin Breeg - Angel or Purge plus Energy
Icarus - Destiny/Sustaining
Sentinel Desert Marauder - Eternity
Astra, Valkyrie Slayer - Angel or Purge plus Venom or Nightmare

It’s a work in progress but it is winning against FFE/Charlotte/Killer Prime/Musashi/HE/DDE builds.

I just realized something interesting today about a character that I haven't used before but might be a new wrinkle. The Crimean warrior has a skill that allows him to do 99 percent of his hit points to and enemy as true damage. He also starts with endure. Pair him with a character that generates power, a healer, and use energy talismans on one and strike and angel on him and you have a character that could be a high damager. What do you think?

Metalking, the Crimean Warrior can do some good amount of damage, but he is a bit weak in HP. Endure is easy to steal so you may need a blocker or he might die in the first round. You can always revive him, he can be used in gauntlet when you are running low on toons.

Stormeseye, Sentinal Desert Guardian really shined this last event against Krampus. His disable passive and blocking ability coupled with Eternal talis makes him a good choice against blocker or pesky toons with a passive ability. I definitely use him in gauntlet. I haven't been that active In the arena., do I haven't tried him against the new toons.

What is your opinion on power vs energy talis. Energy talis gives 3 power on attacks while power gives 1 power per hit when attacked, while giving a power shield. The power shield is kind of weak and can be stolen. In gauntlet where they seem to win the toss more often, being attacked by multi hitters can allow 2 power moves on your first turn. Also if you use energy talis you dont earn power when using power moves. You can still earn power while stunned , frozen or slept. Which is where the game is currently going.

Awhile back when golden gunner dog was used energy talis were a great benefit.

While I was rolling my eyes over Sentinel Desert Guardian, I am also in total agreement, if old ally's is what we're talking about and looking for you won't find too many as good...
A few things I've said before, but worth a mention in this thread, many of you should have realised through Gauntlet that many of those older characters really aren't so underpowered when fitted with the latest and greatest Talisman.

BBE is fantastic when fitted with the warlord talisman (honestly just about any character is better fitted with warlord talisman)

If anyone out there is contemplating a team build based on sleep, look no further than FFE (when you've saved enough frags) besides the insane damage he does, any left standing after his fury are 90% likely to be inflicted with perfect sleep, there's the Assasin Hell Hound we've all rediscovered from Night City inflicting sleep, Magis Mayan Priestess as well and a set of nightmares along with angels in Alchemist could also be good.
The problem I see with sleep is knowing what order of turns and single or multi hitters as you don't want to wake them,
Perfecting that order and the character selection could potentially see the opposition all dead before they even have their turn...

Now to add some weaknesses you may need to exploit on FFE builds I have noticed... I use MLillith as the blocker and Alchemist as the cleanser, Charlotte to remove or steal buffs and revive if necessary, problem is, unlike yesterday's builds centred around gunners, I can't get the fury to go off in one turn anymore, if the blocker is gone FFE is cleaned up rather quickly by any hard hitting warrior class character, also the AI seems to ignore class advantage rules a larger percentage of the time and FFE attracts damage from many of the opposition.. Prisoner in the defence team causes me no end of problems, I have to change my attack and include Prisoner to counter his passive effects,

I have not tested this but I reckon a good counter FFE build should include Prisoner, Sentinel Desert Guardian, Charlotte or Warrior Lillith, BBE or Alex maybe?
I say this perhaps at my own peril...

Something Ive been testing out more, but havent gotten around to much bcause of a lack of materials (too many events I havent had time to do more BNW runs lol). A while ago single target characters seemed at a disadvantage, particularly because their ability to proc talis was limited. Nowadays there are many more options for them, especially ones with good passives. Destiny talis being the first big one, and primordial made the prisoner dominant again. But now we have lots of interesting 2 sets, shields, and talis that proc once per attack regardless of how that attack functions. Im trying to see what old characters are gonna become relevant again because of this; I havent had much time to experiment bcause as I said im lacking mats rn, but its interesting

I have always been a fan of Energy over most other 3 set green talismans. Talisman sets that have a passive ability like Purge or Angel are better for most of my build types. This is mainly because blue beneficial effects can be so easliy stolen or are just temporary for a round or two. The exception is sets that give a beneficial effect on attacks like shields or effect removal. They can be utilized the entire battle as opposed to just at the beginning. Most of the allies that I use Energy on tend to be multi-hitters and have the ability to take extra turns. That means more chance to steal power. Stealing power is better than most negative effects like stun or silence since those can be cleansed. You can have zero negative effects on you but if you have no power you can only use basic attacks or Fury.

I was wondering if anyone uses a fully sharded warrior desert warrior. His normal move heal blocks a single target, while his power move permadeathe a single target. Since he can hold valor talis, he may be of value to shard. I've never seen him in the arena or even gauntlet on lower levels.

ML definitely worth the effort if you can afford the shards, I still find my self wondering what permadeth and doom are for?
Kill your target inflicted with either neg buff and they seem to come back just the same... but try as we must it may help, and stand as it is designed to at some point it might actually help you the way it should!

Btw where do you hail from ML you seem to be awake when everyone else is sleeping?

Rags, I'm from St. Louis, Missouri, USA. I have some medical issues that cause problems with sleeping, I can be up any hour of the day.

Since the warriors sentinal brother has shown his true worth, I was going to give him a try. He may help in gauntlet , especially if he has valor talis benefits.

I hope ML is ok with you? But you are a pioneer my friend, you may well have an advantage over every other average trooper if you keep up this experimenting with old toons!
I too have an unusual sleep time regime... the Mrs keeps strange work related start times which will inevitably effect me to, so I am potentially on the game or forums anytime of day...
So what time of day or night is there anyway?

Its 10:50 PM central time.its 2 hours ahead of Pacific time that NF refers.

It's 4.00 pm roughly in Sydney when you posted that, and stinking f...ing hot about 43. C locally I would normally do the conversion but convert to Fahrenheit and you'll know what we're dealing with...
Just lost to Drinkblood again... damn that's an awesome defense!
Will best him again in a few hours.

Rags, what is the humidity. We dont get that hot to often, but the humidity is what really is the killer.. in summer we dont break 100 F to much, but it happens. When we do the humidity reaches 85+ % which makes it real uncomfortable.
The temp outside now is about 20F, not to bad for this time.of the year.

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Originally Posted by Muzzleloader

Rags, what is the humidity. We dont get that hot to often, but the humidity is what really is the killer.. in summer we dont break 100 F to much, but it happens. When we do the humidity reaches 85+ % which makes it real uncomfortable.
The temp outside now is about 20F, not to bad for this time.of the year.

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Hi again ML sorry for the late reply, it's nice and cool right now but yesterday's humidity was around 60 - 70%, this is normal summer weather we get around 2 to 3 heatwaves like this in a normal season, on normal non heatwave days it's still 89.6 F on average... today's meant to be 102.2 F but out west of sydney it's going to be hotter than that I'd be sure...

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Originally Posted by rags-6094

what permadeth and doom are for?

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I thought they have fixed that since my build relies on Permadeath to counter Osiris/Charlotte and other revivers. Not once has an enemy revived if killed while permadeath or doom were on them. It even kills Icarus dead without revive.


That being said I have been playing with a Doom build that I can’t quite perfect yet. Any input from you hard nosed strategists?

The number of allies with Doom inflicting abilities is rather slime so talismans will have to play a big part.

Mystic Eddie -Destiny/Sustaining - Primarily he is the detonator to this build. His fury, with max shards, has 100% chance of triggering any Doom effects on the opposing team. He can carry Destiny talismans and I like damage mitigation, so he makes and excellent vehicle. He is listed as a Party Enchancer, so his damage is very weak and at best I am ducking and diving to keep him alive until he can Fury. I manage this with the aid of Destiny and his basic attack
Dream, which has a 75% chance to Vanish him every round. I am still trying to incorporate his other skils but they are very awkward.

In order for this build to function, I need to have some way to inflict Doom and capitilize on it before it gets cleansed. Though Mystic can do this, he needs the enemy to have Seal on them, so this requires another ally or talismans to do this and there just isnt room for another specialty ally so we have to dismiss that as a viable Doom source. His fury can also inflict seal but this is a wasted use if the purpose is to use his fury to trigger Doom.

So now lets look at allies that can inflict Doom.

Assassin Derby Demon - I am working on her talismans since she could carry Fate/Angel but I feel her talismans need to be more beneficial to the build and not just to survivability but I will leave this as above till I find something more useful.

Her power move removes Immunity from all enemies and has a 75% chance to inflict Doom on 2 random enemies for 3 turns. Her basic attack can remove all beneficial effects and inflict Block beneficial effects if either Armor/Magic penetration are in place. I could put a set of Magic penetration on her with Fate since we will have a cleanser(see below). Still undecided on that though.

Alchemist - While he is “ tried and true” and “old and boring” in the same mouthful, he can inflict Doom and has unmatched utility. His standard set up for me is Angel/Immortality and I see no reason to change it.

The first two allies are technically interchangable in the build but the fourth spot is a real debate. Mystic will be using Destiny and providing some mitigation but I still may need a blocker since most of the allies are weak.

I can’t decide what to add. A damager like Killer Prime whose passive can help remove Immunity? Another Doom inflicting ally like Sentinel Chopper who can heal, wear Destiny and maybe a bit of damage? A non-common blocker? I hate to resort back to Magus or Marauder as I am trying to bring underutilized allies into the build.

What do you all think?

Stormseye, cant really help you there. I dont have assassin demon derby or killer prime, one vortex away and ran out of time. Did your try assassin undead rescuer for a relatively unused toon. I know his power move only gives 60% chance to apply doom, but it does raise magic and attack for 3 turns.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stormseye

I thought they have fixed that since my build relies on Permadeath to counter Osiris/Charlotte and other revivers. Not once has an enemy revived if killed while permadeath or doom were on them. It even kills Icarus dead without revive.


That being said I have been playing with a Doom build that I can’t quite perfect yet. Any input from you hard nosed strategists?

The number of allies with Doom inflicting abilities is rather slime so talismans will have to play a big part.

Mystic Eddie -Destiny/Sustaining - Primarily he is the detonator to this build. His fury, with max shards, has 100% chance of triggering any Doom effects on the opposing team. He can carry Destiny talismans and I like damage mitigation, so he makes and excellent vehicle. He is listed as a Party Enchancer, so his damage is very weak and at best I am ducking and diving to keep him alive until he can Fury. I manage this with the aid of Destiny and his basic attack
Dream, which has a 75% chance to Vanish him every round. I am still trying to incorporate his other skils but they are very awkward.

In order for this build to function, I need to have some way to inflict Doom and capitilize on it before it gets cleansed. Though Mystic can do this, he needs the enemy to have Seal on them, so this requires another ally or talismans to do this and there just isnt room for another specialty ally so we have to dismiss that as a viable Doom source. His fury can also inflict seal but this is a wasted use if the purpose is to use his fury to trigger Doom.

So now lets look at allies that can inflict Doom.

Assassin Derby Demon - I am working on her talismans since she could carry Fate/Angel but I feel her talismans need to be more beneficial to the build and not just to survivability but I will leave this as above till I find something more useful.

Her power move removes Immunity from all enemies and has a 75% chance to inflict Doom on 2 random enemies for 3 turns. Her basic attack can remove all beneficial effects and inflict Block beneficial effects if either Armor/Magic penetration are in place. I could put a set of Magic penetration on her with Fate since we will have a cleanser(see below). Still undecided on that though.

Alchemist - While he is “ tried and true” and “old and boring” in the same mouthful, he can inflict Doom and has unmatched utility. His standard set up for me is Angel/Immortality and I see no reason to change it.

The first two allies are technically interchangable in the build but the fourth spot is a real debate. Mystic will be using Destiny and providing some mitigation but I still may need a blocker since most of the allies are weak.

I can’t decide what to add. A damager like Killer Prime whose passive can help remove Immunity? Another Doom inflicting ally like Sentinel Chopper who can heal, wear Destiny and maybe a bit of damage? A non-common blocker? I hate to resort back to Magus or Marauder as I am trying to bring underutilized allies into the build.

What do you all think?

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Hi Stormseye I think The Witch Doctor has a doom ability and a cleansing ability too.... FFE also has a doom ability of sorts for when you get him, but that won't help with old Mystic,...

Beast Eddie he's a doom option as well. I think it's in his fury.