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  1. #21
    Senior Member Yup's Avatar
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    It's the Sacred set on allies. The Sacreds .... "% chance to grant allies heal shield for 2 turns when taking damage".. or it cleanses and grants it all to allies upon death....those buffs get applied to Moonchild even though you can't see them. I also think he's getting Perfect Health at times.. and Cleanse... Moonchild will also take damage after he attacks at times as if from Punishment or Burn buffs or something - not a lot of damage, but clearly damage. And Marks work on Moonchild even though you can't see the marks. All the buffs work for the most part, they are just invisible. I obviously can't verify some things like Corruption or Ascension... but the standard red/blue/green/orange/purple buffs all seem to work.

    Quote Originally Posted by Horus-2545 View Post
    Yup, I've only been playing this game for just over a year. Do you remember another character that was as problematic as Moonchild (and I know you have argued that he is not that problematic if you bring multihitters). I was just curious if this is an isolated incident or a recurrent thing.
    The Prisoner and his passive has always caused unexpected issues.... since I started playing. The fact that currently the Prisoner doesn't seem to have any major issue is kind of not the norm. Prior to last months update, the Prisoner was disabling all passives on all enemies, ignoring Singularity talismans and immunity. Using him was one sure-fire way to kill Moonchild or any team with Moonchld rather easily. (This no longer works though)

    And for Moonchild it's specifically multihitters that cause Moonchild to heal... see above If you only hit Moonchild with a single hitter, you can whittle him down, even if he has Vampire.. assuming you also have a max-awakened Moonchild.

    Single fighters left..... Moonchild + Labyrinth + Echo, manually ALWAYS beats Moonchild + Labyrinth + Vampire, AI -- manually you get more "prefect" hits and Echo grants you more turns. If it's Moonchild v Moonchild, the vampires, when they do heal, don't heal for as much as if they only hit 1 opponent. It's when they hit 2, 3 or 4 opponents that they pretty much full-heal the AI Moonchild. He's actually harder to kill if you have more allies alive.
    Last edited by Yup; 01-10-2020 at 11:14 AM.
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  2. #22
    Senior Member URock's Avatar
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    A limit of a number of rounds to all buffs would be nice. Many builds would be playable and we'll not have these boring 10 minute fights leading to draw.
    Last edited by URock; 01-10-2020 at 12:42 PM.

  3. #23
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    BHE may be broken, but ECE Eddie can apply a bunch of Marks that last 4 turns. So if you donít hit perfectly for a few turns and build them up then crack him with a perfect, it breaks through the sacred combo and he will die.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yup View Post
    It's the Sacred set on allies. The Sacreds .... "% chance to grant allies heal shield for 2 turns when taking damage".. or it cleanses and grants it all to allies upon death....those buffs get applied to Moonchild even though you can't see them. I also think he's getting Perfect Health at times.. and Cleanse... Moonchild will also take damage after he attacks at times as if from Punishment or Burn buffs or something - not a lot of damage, but clearly damage. And Marks work on Moonchild even though you can't see the marks. All the buffs work for the most part, they are just invisible. I obviously can't verify some things like Corruption or Ascension... but the standard red/blue/green/orange/purple buffs all seem to work.



    The Prisoner and his passive has always caused unexpected issues.... since I started playing. The fact that currently the Prisoner doesn't seem to have any major issue is kind of not the norm. Prior to last months update, the Prisoner was disabling all passives on all enemies, ignoring Singularity talismans and immunity. Using him was one sure-fire way to kill Moonchild or any team with Moonchld rather easily. (This no longer works though)

    And for Moonchild it's specifically multihitters that cause Moonchild to heal... see above If you only hit Moonchild with a single hitter, you can whittle him down, even if he has Vampire.. assuming you also have a max-awakened Moonchild.

    Single fighters left..... Moonchild + Labyrinth + Echo, manually ALWAYS beats Moonchild + Labyrinth + Vampire, AI -- manually you get more "prefect" hits and Echo grants you more turns. If it's Moonchild v Moonchild, the vampires, when they do heal, don't heal for as much as if they only hit 1 opponent. It's when they hit 2, 3 or 4 opponents that they pretty much full-heal the AI Moonchild. He's actually harder to kill if you have more allies alive.
    A multi hitter like ECE Eddie with quantum beats moonchild (with vampiric) in 2-3 turns.

  5. #25
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    bugged you say?

    despite the fact that it is obvious it has perfect disable (and more debuffs) I was still not able to use any power moves (and fury when lucy got cleansed).
    thankfully I was able to beat that gauntlet move, which included putting perfect disable to dark lilith, which actually worked

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yup View Post
    It's the Sacred set on allies. The Sacreds .... "% chance to grant allies heal shield for 2 turns when taking damage".. or it cleanses and grants it all to allies upon death....those buffs get applied to Moonchild even though you can't see them. I also think he's getting Perfect Health at times.. and Cleanse... Moonchild will also take damage after he attacks at times as if from Punishment or Burn buffs or something - not a lot of damage, but clearly damage. And Marks work on Moonchild even though you can't see the marks. All the buffs work for the most part, they are just invisible. I obviously can't verify some things like Corruption or Ascension... but the standard red/blue/green/orange/purple buffs all seem to work.



    The Prisoner and his passive has always caused unexpected issues.... since I started playing. The fact that currently the Prisoner doesn't seem to have any major issue is kind of not the norm. Prior to last months update, the Prisoner was disabling all passives on all enemies, ignoring Singularity talismans and immunity. Using him was one sure-fire way to kill Moonchild or any team with Moonchld rather easily. (This no longer works though)
    Yeah, this is one thing that's puzzling me in the Arena now. Moonchild's passive says it can only be countered by passive disable applied at the beginning of battle. But more than half the battles where I take my Prisoner against Moonchild, it doesn't disable his passive. Why? Sometimes those teams start with talismans/passives that say they give immunity to all allies, or cleanse to all allies... but Moonchild is not supposed to get those (or any) buffs, so how do they prevent the passive disable?

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by purplepeople View Post
    Yeah, this is one thing that's puzzling me in the Arena now. Moonchild's passive says it can only be countered by passive disable applied at the beginning of battle. But more than half the battles where I take my Prisoner against Moonchild, it doesn't disable his passive. Why? Sometimes those teams start with talismans/passives that say they give immunity to all allies, or cleanse to all allies... but Moonchild is not supposed to get those (or any) buffs, so how do they prevent the passive disable?
    prisoner currently has issues with things. there are several other places where he isn't functioning correctly. a lot of it is fairly current but part of it is when his passive disable also disabled talisman part of the time. so most of it is they probably havent managed to fix him. which is another story altogether.

  8. #28
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    And this is where I mention what I have been thinking about Arena for a long long long time, and yes I mentioned this in the worst bug in arena thread already. And the only place I would want to see the following implemented is in the Arena everything else would stay the same as it is.

    I am in favor of a complete Arena rebuild. As it is Arena is not able to be won by anyone and everyone. About the only way to win is to have a team of top echelon characters and talisman. Yes there is a time and SoW commitment in there along with other things that I am forgetting and just not mentioning. Toss in the lovely arena event that we just had and its even more annoying. So yeah I think Arena needs to be completely rebuilt in a manner that actually levels the playing field out a bit. There isn't a way to completely level it out nor should there be. People who invest the $ and time etc should be able to reap the benefits of such investments. But it should be set up so those of us who can invest the time, SoW, have a competent team, have the ability to counter top echelon teams, and a bit of luck can beat it. It should be a strategy type item not a I have the impossible to beat talisman and characters.

    Back in the beginning of the game the characters were set up with a point value (I don't know if this has been removed or not because I can't see it). I don't think I ever encountered a situation where I had a team that had more points than I could field. Which makes me think that this point or value assignment to characters wasn't really for the main story but for when the Arena was introduced.

    I would like to see this brought back into play specifically for the Arena. Where you can only field a team that has a combined value of X points. Using the first post in this thread as an example BHE with M Fortune, D Lilith(maxed), MChild (maxed). Lets say this is the current top echelon team. You wouldn't be able to use it because your points would be over. Lets say 25 points is a top tier character. BHE, Lilith and MChild would definitely fit the bill here. MFortune might be a tier 2 with a value of 20 points. That would give us 95 points on this team. So where should the line be as far as team point value? With 4 characters that would be a max of 100 points but it would be all top tier and not change anything. How about 80 points. That allows you to have 2 tier 1 for 50 points and 30 points to round things out. Or 1 tier 1 (25) with 2 tier 2 (40) and 1 tier 3 (15). Or any other combination of 80 points.

    This would help immensely in evening things out but lets take it one set further.

    A point set up for talisman. Same basic concept as above. The only difference would be in having 2 point totals. One for the character and one for the team overall. Tier 1(20) would be things like Starfire and Labyrinth. Tier 2(15) would be more like Orbit and Venom. Tier 3 (10) along the lines of necropolis. Tier 4(5) say comet, lightning, explosive. Tier 5 (0) would be health, holy, endure and such. With an arena max of 25 points per character and 80 per team. This won't eliminate all of the more annoying talisman combinations at all but it would eliminate some. Especially when things like Angel start showing up as a cosmic talisman. (Labyrinth and Angel is very annoying in my opinion.)

    Can also outright eliminate specific combinations of talisman in the Arena. If this talisman is worn this one can't be etc..

    Another item that could also be tossed into the mix is add some negative aspects. And this is where I think one of the biggest fails has happened. With very few exceptions (characters and talisman) there are no negative effects generated by talisman or character combinations. How to make the labyrinth talisman a questionable item to use is simple. Add a clause to it that there is a 10% failure rate where all attacks hit you and cause 50% more damage than normal. Or say The Prisoner and The Alchemist despise each other and lower the teams atk and magic by 25%.

    At the same time I do find it fascinating that the code for the talisman is so mucked up that it causes so many things to happen. For more on this there are a slew of threads discussing characters being dead but talisman effects still being applied and then characters resurrecting that well shouldn't be and so on and so forth. Implementing this would force them to revisit and probably rewrite a significant amount of code.

    Basically there is a LOT that could be done to clean up and improve the Arena and the rest of the game overall. Unfortunately I don't think they are going to do much to fix it unless it actually causes the game to break.

  9. #29
    Senior Member Stormseye's Avatar
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    Some times the beneficial effects are not even hidden...

    https://youtu.be/jnOuHN8rH-w
    Last edited by Stormseye; 01-13-2020 at 05:21 PM.
    ...When all you see can only bring you sadness...

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  10. #30
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    Haha. Moonchild is even wrecking gauntlet.

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