PvP broken mechanics

[Sag7272]

If you attack a Prisoner/DM combo without a Prisoner and they have a Golden Son on the team, I don't think a cleanser will help if you go second - cause he'll be frozen too.

Well I ment with a single hit chance like against all non Golden sons...

[MrFreeze]

Yeah I don't like seeing characters nerfed. It feels like we're going backwards when that happens. I thought the purple pyro people eater had the same passive as the DM. Your saying they don't work the same? thats odd.

[Frost]

So according to some guys I'm a whinner because I say Prisoner has no counter...

Even when top players say they never attack someone without a Prisoner themselves, and 7 outta 10 players in top have a Prisoner...

So it's simple. Dev teams start takikng statistics on the winning percentage of teams with him.

C'mon guys, Prisoner alone is fine, but couple him with one or two toons and you know you'll win almost 100% of the time. You know he has no counter, even with a fully maxed team you will lose if you go second no matter what you throw at him.

Or leave it as it is, when the release of PvP goes global it will be 10 outta 10 players with Prisoner and it'll be decided by who goes first anyway.

[Shaolin85london]

Frost, I often go for second against prisoner, troll and CG, and due my corr rescuer gunner or just a bit of luck, I hold the opposite team winning the match. It's all about some key strategy steps, even the order of attack opposite team, for instance. U never know...

[CanyptianFit]

Agree Shaolin85london I beat The prisoner going second with character selection and a bit of luck. Definitely a challenge, but doable. Yesterday I had a number of "top 5" prisoner hits and faired ok.

[Roquetas-5312]

Well regarding the prisoner he does have a counter and that's to have a prisoner yourself
Blame the RNG not the mechanics
As for always winning if goes first that is not correct
Going first does gives an advantage to whatever team you have but is not gaurenteed by any means

[CanyptianFit]

What we are saying Frost is don't give up hope. Keep trying different strategies and improving your team. It can be done bud!

[slauki]

one further argument against the prisoner...

once you have him in this state of the game, you will put him into your defense, no matter what. He is a must have atm if you want to have a great defense.
Yeah there are more great defenses without him, but he is the most powerfull character in PVP atm.
So if nothing changes in a few months 90% of all defenses will have a prisoner in it, because there is no way around. That's the best proof how imbalanced the situation is atm. Once you got him he is part of your team. We need at least one or two more characters with the same passive and things would be better i think. Or if the passive removes also the own passives things would also be better IMO.

Nicko mentioned several times, that prisoners are popping up like mad in PVP. IMO that's a big bias. They are not popping up like mad, it's simply
that the guys who have him, will be at the top of the PVP leaderbord most likely. So most you see is prisoners out there in the top 25.

Do you really want to play against same defenses again and again? This is really hurting the game dynamics.

[Nicko]

Nicko mentioned several times, that prisoners are popping up like mad in PVP. IMO that's a big bias. They are not popping up like mad, it's simply
that the guys who have him, will be at the top of the PVP leaderbord most likely. So most you see is prisoners out there in the top 25.

Do you really want to play against same defenses again and again? This is really hurting the game dynamics.

I don't think it's accurate to say that Slauki, he's just not rare anymore. A number of people have mentioned recently getting him. Someone I know (not me, though I have two) mentioned getting his THIRD Prisoner.

Most I see with Prisoners in their defense do NOT have Hellhounds or Assassin Rocket Dogs so it's still possible to stun/freeze/taunt them. He's just deadliest combined with a DM

[The Educated fool]

one further argument against the prisoner...

once you have him in this state of the game, you will put him into your defence, no matter what.

Ah, but good sir, the reality is that no matter what changes you make, there will always be a reasonably short list of characters that work best for defence, and these will always be the characters that people will use in various combinations, once they get them. Regardless of changes too, there will always be a single best defensive character... would it not be best if that character was indeed somewhat rare?

Sticking with the Prisoner as an example, if his passive was given to other characters, you would see those characters showing up in people's defences when they were available too, and, unless the characters had the exact same other abilities as the Prisoner, you would see some used in defences more than others. By giving this passive to other characters then, you would end up with more defensive teams built around the same characters than ever... not less.

The bottom line is, no matter who you nerf, some characters will always be better than others, and this is what makes them desirable, and what will make people keep playing to earn and and paying to buy souls in order to be lucky enough to pull these characters. The Prisoner is currently the strongest (arguably--at least, the one you fight latest in the game campaign) boss character that can be drawn... does it not make sense that he would be one of the most desirable characters?