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  1. #1
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    Loving that defense Nicko

    We should just call it win the toss or force quit!
    I don't see how any team could possibly recover and win if they go second against that D
    Well played sir!

  2. #2
    Senior Member Nicko's Avatar
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    Thanks EZZ! There's a few ways the cards can fall and they don't always mean instant death - but certainly this is the best Hold percentage I've had in a while going into Friday.

    Have to say though it pales in comparison to a beta defense I had. Talismans were broken and a Gunner Golden Son would freeze every opponent - with perfect hits guaranteed by a DM - and steal fury, instantly filling the fury meter of Tailgunner Eddie ( a Gimp made Trolls and Hellhounds ineffective). It was then lights out.

    My Hold percentage in its best week was 60%
    Last edited by Nicko; 08-04-2017 at 01:03 AM.
    Nicko-0517

  3. #3
    angelkelly
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    Explosive Talismans For The Win.

    ...........
    Last edited by angelkelly; 05-25-2020 at 02:38 AM.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Nicko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by angelkelly View Post
    Well I just fought against nicko team and I must say it was instant death.
    So if anything I wouldn't consider his team great nor appealing. More so bugged asf.
    I agree. It sucks
    Nicko-0517

  5. #5
    Senior Member slauki's Avatar
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    i really do appreciate nickos teams from time to time, because they clearly show how broken some chars and mechanics are. otherwise many would still try to tell the story how "strong" specific characters are. they are not strong, they are completly out of line. same for explosives, stunning for one turn could be perfectly fine but making a singlehitter into a potential 2 tuns aoe stun machine (even harpies will get stunned) is absolutely ridiculous.


    edit:
    btw: that we can almost compare nicos defense nowadays with the broken beta defense says a lot too
    Last edited by slauki; 08-04-2017 at 04:12 AM.


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  6. #6
    Senior Member Nicko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by angelkelly View Post
    Sarcasm at it's finest.
    @Nicko the lousy Burrito.
    Eat up champ, I know you love those wins.
    Thanks Angel Kelly - you always charm with your posts
    Last edited by Nicko; 08-04-2017 at 04:26 AM.
    Nicko-0517

  7. #7
    Senior Member Nicko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slauki View Post
    i really do appreciate nickos teams from time to time, because they clearly show how broken some chars and mechanics are. otherwise many would still try to tell the story how "strong" specific characters are. they are not strong, they are completly out of line. same for explosives, stunning for one turn could be perfectly fine but making a singlehitter into a potential 2 tuns aoe stun machine (even harpies will get stunned) is absolutely ridiculous.


    edit:
    btw: that we can almost compare nicos defense nowadays with the broken beta defense says a lot too
    Hey Slauki - you know my Hold percentage - and it doesn't come close to those 60% Beta days

    And while I see the arguments as far as some of the talisman mechanics - most are getting fixed - and I wouldn't be surprised if it leads to some griping. Players are complaining their Holds are falling - and once these Talisman adjustments occur they'll likely fall even more. AI simply can't compete with a human, so these little "broken" mechanics give the AI a glimmer of hope. Will players be ok with 12% Hold rates?

    I think if the AI had 90% perfect hits we could do away with some of this stuff and still see decent Hold rates. The ability to check off whether to use power moves or not would also be really valuable. Who goes first will always be huge - but some easy tweaks like perfect hits and selectable power moves would allow reasonable Holds without having to rely on what you call "broken" mechanics.
    Last edited by Nicko; 08-04-2017 at 05:54 AM.
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  8. #8
    Senior Member Patrice-1201's Avatar
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    isn't the issue though that if your defence goes second (like it just did against me) then it's instant death for your double Wrath :-( Which means that your hold percentage equals your coin toss success percentage ;-) so will be interested in seeing how much of these coin tosses you win ;-)
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  9. #9
    Senior Member slauki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicko View Post
    Hey Slauki - you know my Hold percentage - and it doesn't come close to those 60% Beta days

    And while I see the arguments as far as some of the talisman mechanics - most are getting fixed - and I wouldn't be surprised if it leads to some griping. Players are complaining their Holds are falling - and once these Talisman adjustments occur they'll likely fall even more. AI simply can't compete with a human, so these little "broken" mechanics give the AI a glimmer of hope. Will players be ok with 12% Hold rates?

    I think if the AI had 90% perfect hits we could do away with some of this stuff and still see decent Hold rates. The ability to check off whether to use power moves or not would also be really valuable. Who goes first will always be huge - but some easy tweaks like perfect hits and selectable power moves would allow reasonable Holds without having to rely on what you call "broken" mechanics.
    you know i love needeling a bit it's not so broken like in early days for sure, but it's still kinda broken . pretty simple rule of common sense "if you cannot counter it, with all available tools it's broken".
    i never think it's the fault of the player if the system is wrong so it's a really smart setup which i like too. would i use a similar defense if i was able? hell yeah i would .
    all in all i don't expect too much of a difference after the BNW update aside the energy and the void shields. not sure if the explosives are on the radar of the devs, so i could imagine this team will still be very good for a long time. and it's really screwed, that such crucial talismans are only available for a few guys, at least this will come to an end soon.

    but now i predict this following circle:

    this setup will become more popular --> we will se more 2 wrath combos with similar setups --> it will kill the divesity of pvp and devide the players into "haves and not haves" and the complains will rise --->it might take some weeks or some months till devs realize this and then --> the inevitable nerf will come :P

    hope they will find a better way, but i would place a 10$ bet on this i like he 90% perfect hit idea and the selectable powermove idea too, but this might take a while, i'm afraid...


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  10. #10
    Senior Member Nicko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slauki View Post
    you know i love needeling a bit it's not so broken like in early days for sure, but it's still kinda broken . pretty simple rule of common sense "if you cannot counter it, with all available tools it's broken".
    i never think it's the fault of the player if the system is wrong so it's a really smart setup which i like too. would i use a similar defense if i was able? hell yeah i would .
    all in all i don't expect too much of a difference after the BNW update aside the energy and the void shields. not sure if the explosives are on the radar of the devs, so i could imagine this team will still be very good for a long time. and it's really screwed, that such crucial talismans are only available for a few guys, at least this will come to an end soon.

    but now i predict this following circle:

    this setup will become more popular --> we will se more 2 wrath combos with similar setups --> it will kill the divesity of pvp and devide the players into "haves and not haves" and the complains will rise --->it might take some weeks or some months till devs realize this and then --> the inevitable nerf will come :P

    hope they will find a better way, but i would place a 10$ bet on this i like he 90% perfect hit idea and the selectable powermove idea too, but this might take a while, i'm afraid...
    Disagree . I've faced a couple 2-Wrath defenses; they often aren't difficult. I had to try many combinations this week before this current configuration - SSD, Clairvoyant, Nomad, Shaman Eddie, VHE...

    All of them were better than my last weeks dismal Hold percentage - which was below 20% - but it took the DM to give it some consistency (just as it did in my beta defense) - I don't think the difference maker is the second Wrath. When the energy talismans get adjusted I don't think you'll see 2 Wrath defenses unless combined with TWO toons who can feed him power (AG? Cyborg?) - and even then you're depending on the cards to fall in a very particular way.

    My win rate this week so far is 98% - if we all had that then by definition defensive Hold rates would be 2%. I haven't faced Kamuz once - because the cards so often fall the same way when I face him - Wrath goes first - steals energy and removes buffs - Nomad power move - no energy to heal and facing a Beelze with Strikes. I faced him two times last Saturday and when the cards DIDN'T fall that way it was a fairly straightforward win. When these Talismans get adjusted I won't sweat facing him at all. I would imagine right now his Hold percentage is better than mine - it's mechanics are no different but it can win going second (mine doesn't have a prayer if it doesn't go first).

    Our win rates will rise. Hold rates will fall. And people will gripe about not being able to Hold...
    Last edited by Nicko; 08-04-2017 at 02:14 PM.
    Nicko-0517

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