Why Relics are BAD for the game, my LotB story.

[hold]

While I can't wholeheartedly agree with what everyone is saying, I can't exactly disagree either, since these new relics came out things have probably changed enormously in the higher upper ranks, but for me, ehh they're still kinda the same. The only time I willingly went to the highest rank I could get I was far too stressed out about staying there I decided it wasn't for me.

Anyways back to the subject. There's a counter to relics, and that's in the new "Exhaust" effect. Exhaust reduces all stats except for health by I think 90%, meaning that those fancy new relics wouldn't be able to save you. Right now there are two ways of applying this,

1: Zone Talismans, not exactly my personal go to since they're hard as dick to acquire, but I think they can affect everyone if I'm not mistaken.

2: Magus Lilith: again not that easy to find but I think she can only apply it to one enemy at a time.

And for the health part of it, we're waiting to get a chance to obtain Necropolis Talismans, and they're reduce the overall health of someone every time you hit them. That's really brutal if you think about it. They could show up in the next arena event for all I know.


So to wrap it up, yes I agree that at the current moment, those who had a large cache of iron coins are going to benefit more from the new release than those without, and new players may have a tough time against someone who has them. But hey, they start out really cheap, plus everyone talks about the fact that the Gauntlet WILL be another way of getting them. So sooner or later PvP won't be "forcing you to play".

CR fury ... if you stay alive long enough ...

[Nifelheim]

I think they are good for the game:

-Helps you if you lose the coin toss
-Top grinders to casual pvp'ers will be against similar rank on atk list
-Gives help to those who don't have a lot of natural 5* troopers/bad rng
-More long term goals. How often do you read of someone saying "boring,need new content, where's night city, etc"
-helps balance gunner/assassin troopers with low health/def/magic resist to sentinels who lack atk/magic

There are more pros/cons I'm sure but this is a new aspect and will play out in the coming weeks

[Sponholz]

I think they are good for the game:

1 -Helps you if you lose the coin toss
2 -Top grinders to casual pvp'ers will be against similar rank on atk list
3 -Gives help to those who don't have a lot of natural 5* troopers/bad rng
4 -More long term goals. How often do you read of someone saying "boring,need new content, where's night city, etc"
5 -helps balance gunner/assassin troopers with low health/def/magic resist to sentinels who lack atk/magic

There are more pros/cons I'm sure but this is a new aspect and will play out in the coming weeks

I also think they are good for the game (PvE), but not for Arena.

1 - You are probably right, except that if are being matched with Relic powered/boosted teams, something is already not going well on the matchmaking of the game.
2 - IF and that's a big IF the matchmaking is improved based on overal stats of the team (or something similar that takes into account the relic lvl of the teams that show up on the list), right now is based on your rating.
3 - Again, this should not be a issue if the matchmaking were done based on other factors and not mainly(only?) on rating. Oh and Speed of Light Eddie and Sentinel Desert Guardian are both amazing right now, a 3* and a 2* (story one).
4 - Relics are NOT new content, Night City and Gauntlet will be, Relics are just new Items being sold on the Arena store for now.
5 - I honestly thought they already were, sorry mate, no need to balance this trough something like Relics, I have gotten my ass handed to me a LOT of times by gunners/assassins even when using HP monsters like Viking and/or Visions. And vice-versa I also winned a lot of battles using Visions against g/a teams, the game stat wise was well balanced IMO.

Please take note, that I am expressing my opinion on the Relics and trying to explain my concerns in implementing then in the game WITHOUT any new content to support the inclusion of then in the first place!

Ask yourself if you needed Relic right now in the first place.

If your answer is: Well I need new stuff to do in the game, so Relics are a nice addition, sorry to disappoint you, but you are NOT doing new stuff, you are still playing the same content we have prior to the Relics, and are just farming 10 (or 1) IC at a time for then, you are not doing something new.

They are a nice addition for sure, I like to think of then being a new lvling system, but they can't be considered "new content".

... Ed.

[mk ultra]

I don't see the relics as a bad thing. "The gap" everyone is complaining about is not that big. I am fighting all top teams, many with 100% health boost, and still not do not loose more than usual. The flights only got a little longer. I had only 4k iron coins and those came only from free sows and doing 200 battles per week with around 95% wins.
On the other hand you can't expect to be at the same level with top players without investing as much time.

[Bradata]

I never considered myself top player but seeing my name mentioned as one of them... me like it.
While I agree with your concerns regarding the relics I can assure you that they aren't as powerful as you think. My defense gets their ass kicked by teams that when I revenge them they are gone in 2 turns at the most which tells me they don't have any relics applied but the players still managed to beat me.
But then lets look from the point of view of the "top" players. They have A LOT of iron coins why, because they played and won a lot of fights for a very long time and they may see this as reward for their effort and time spent here. I was the same as you, very competitive even when I didn't have the OP characters the others had. Many even mentioned that Bradata would revenge anyone even the teams with Prisoner, that guy was the one everyone wanted and I didn't have him then.
Relics give us some boost, I agree but very soon most of the players who really play the game will have them maxed and then back to as it was before the relics.
Is this fare? May be not but then nothing is perfect as we all wish to be. Spent all of my ironites on trying to get Lilith, at least one and nada! And some would say that "top" players are favored more than the rest, not true, they just push more than the rest and that's why they have more than the others.

[Yup]

Anyways back to the subject. There's a counter to relics, and that's in the new "Exhaust" effect. Exhaust reduces all stats except for health by I think 90%, meaning that those fancy new relics wouldn't be able to save you. Right now there are two ways of applying this,

2: Magus Lilith: again not that easy to find but I think she can only apply it to one enemy at a time.

Have her.. yeah 1 at a time.. and running AMOLOD with her... it's really NOT that impactful on enemies. I mean I see her cast Exhaust on Pyro Soldiers... but they still seem to survive a hit. So 90%?? Not quite sure about that....



To me.. PvP has ALWAYS been about the amount of time your'e willing to play. Now... with Relics, it is merely more obvious, but it hasn't changed.

[Sponholz]

Sup all...

Ok, I can see your point Bradata, I can't say I agree tho, plz don't get me wrong, but Relics are not a reward (quoting you: "they may see this as reward for their effort and time spent here"), they are just an unneeded addition to the game atm.

There is NO NEW CONTENT, so they serve to what? Brag yourself about how even more easily you are beating teams in the Arena?

You said they aren't as powerful as most think, Ok, then why put shards on our characters in the first place? the shard basically (scale is a factor I know) do what Relics do, raise some % on some skills.

The GAP will exist for a LONG time ahead.

I don't want to offend anyone here, plz don't take it personal, but sometimes I feel that we are like dogs, that every now-and-then NF trow us a bone and we all became happy little puppies.

Ok, anyone can come here and say:

Oh, SOON™ we will have Gauntlet, man it isn't even on BETA stage yet!!!! Plz don't fool yourself thinking the "Other ways of getting Iron Coins AKA: Gauntlet" Will be available next week...

But If you say they are not as powerful I take your word for it, since I don't have enough Iron Coins to test then all, but any Relic you have that an opponent doesn't its a clear advantage to you.

This is just math, X + Y% > X



Finally, again... I AM NOT AGAINST RELICS!!!! I just don't think they are needed and/or should've been implemented in the game WITHOUT extra modes to support then.

They are NOT needed to finish the game on any difficulty, and they are NOT needed in the Arena.

And sometimes I amaze myself when some people here say that in some months they will have then maxed, hell its 210,000+ Iron Coins. I hope I am wrong here, but I don't think Gauntlet is coming anytime soon, and besides I don't think Gauntlet will trow Iron Coins out of nothing for us, we WILL have to farm, and for quite a while.



Oh, and ADS are coming to the game, pretty, pretty soon!!! (not Blizzard's soon, soon for real).



You all can call then whatever you want to make you feel better tho, but in the end they are a poor addition to the game until new modes become available. (hell even for the new modes they woudn't be needed, I just like then for the fact that its another form of leveling up your characters).

If someone feel offended by my post, please don't take it personal, but I can't be the only one seeing the big picture here...


... Ed.

[Bradata]

Spon, I don't think anyone would be offended by your posts, man! In many of them I can say for sure that you are expressing the frustration for many of us, me included. Many things were done that we don't like in this game, don't get me started on the feature where now we can see what team set up the players who attacked you had. But this is something that deserves it's own thread.
Forum is for us to share our thoughts on the game and hopefully make the devs change the thinks we consider bad.
Cheers!

[Sponholz]

Thanks Bradata, really appreciate the reply, like honestly.


I know sometimes I sound like and grumpy old man.

But I like this game, and I am worried about the future for it, I know the devs have they way of seeing things, long-term wise most of the times.

And I am worried that this type of rushed additions to the game (LotB in it's current state doesn't needed Relics at all), will drive new players (and sources of income) away from the game.


You know what would be a KILLER addition to the game? a faster way to use our Troopers! then we could use the "new free" time to farm expensive dungeons like BNW or LoL more then usual.

Relics should've been released within the Gauntlet or any other mode that would help to alleviate the farm for then.


... Ed.

[Yup]

I think we need to quit calling this a "game". Games have endings, You can win a game, you can beat a game. LOTB is NOT a "game". At best it's a collection, at worst it's a slot machine for intangible items.

I mean if it were actually a "game" you'd level past 100.... you'd continually be building experience.... you'd be conquering new worlds and new challenges... not merely collecting more shit to make your already collected shit be different than the shit other "players' have collected.

Hey monkey.. here's some carrots to make a different colored handful to throw at the some window you've been throwing at!!!! Ain't it so much better than the brown handful???

This being posted, I do NOT fault the developers.. heck capitalism is capitalism. I think any "player" who reaches level 100... beats Underworld Madness... then.. still plays for a bit and fails to realize that THER IS NO END, NO GOAL, NO ACCOMPLISHMENTS, NO WAY TO "WIN" anything.... is their own worst enemy.