April 2017 Tuning Discussion - PRELIMINARY

[Nicko]

And honestly - the suggestion about simply banning him from PvP and leaving him "as is" may not be a bad idea...

[Sag7272]

And honestly - the suggestion about simply banning him from PvP and leaving him "as is" may not be a bad idea...

Maybe keeping the idea of his passive being a buff but on 100% if opponents, he'd at least keep his revelence in PvE while still being counterable in the PvP, half of that nerf may be a decent solution to keep some 5* worth, but again those are just my 2 cents..

[Jofer16]

And honestly - the suggestion about simply banning him from PvP and leaving him "as is" may not be a bad idea...

Yeah the fact he's destroyed in PvE is annoying. He's a staple in my teams and don't feel like dealing with LoL without him, too much time and boring self resses.

This quote from Thanos awesome post earlier is my main objection with these nerfs:

"P.S. I do not have a Prisoner, W. Troll, AoF or many other great characters. I hope to one day…but that hope will be lost if the nerf bat continues to swing."

If the fun characters are nerfed this game gets real boring real fast, if the gameplay is slowed down by making all characters boring and "fair" it takes the excitement out of chasing the top meta. Changing the meta by gutting what's fun and not adding new OP meta is bass ackwards. I know if battles essentially become a boring coin flip I'll be out. Most of the fun is chasing and using characters like The Prisoner. I feel bad for people like Shaolin who obviously wanted one forever only to have it obliterated after he recently got him.

I'm not in the "participation medal" camp when it comes to competition. The direction this game is taking makes me believe whoevers making the final decisions is.

[HomemLivre]

Leave the Prisoner out of the PvP, ok.
Nerfing him, let people be more creative and make PvP a place for more combos and chars combinations, ok.

Is he really important in PvE like you guys are talking about?
I don't have him and Im managed to auto-play everthing with a fast 100% victory chance, even LoL. I really want to understand where is he so important in PvE. Tested some troopers Prisoners and the timming was the same.

[Jofer16]

Leave the Prisoner out of the PvP, ok.
Nerfing him, let people be more creative and make PvP a place for more combos and chars combinations, ok.

Is he really important in PvE like you guys are talking about?
I don't have him and Im managed to auto-play everthing with a fast 100% victory chance, even LoL. I really want to understand where is he so important in PvE. Tested some troopers Prisoners and the timming was the same.

So by your own definition, the nerf is unjustified if he's easily replaceable. Some people just like using our favorite characters. I didn't jump on the bandwagon after he became OP in arena, he's always been my dude from day one, he simply makes the game more enjoyable for me.

Like others have said it just kills any motivation to invest in characters. I too want to max out GRE but no way now with all the talk of OP. Changing the meta by subtraction and not addition is just a bad trend/direction to take. I've already had this with other favorite characters (corrupt general, etc) and it's getting old.

[Sag7272]

Leave the Prisoner out of the PvP, ok.
Nerfing him, let people be more creative and make PvP a place for more combos and chars combinations, ok.
Is he really important in PvE like you guys are talking about?
I don't have him and Im managed to auto-play everthing with a fast 100% victory chance, even LoL. I really want to understand where is he so important in PvE. Tested some troopers Prisoners and the timming was the same.

Still, in PvE he have his use, building "compensation" team to workaround especially while having him fully built is awful.. The set Nerf target at castrating him more than leveling him... Hence my comment, ant those of everyone, there got to be a way of balancing things without simply draining all mights out of a toon...
Making him counterable is one thing, reducing by half his only useful power on top of that just nullify him... Can already see PvE progressing players be like, wait, was that really a boss?

[gmac]

Hi guys,

Hate me but I'm in favor of The Prisoner nerf.

That passive is too powerful and has no counter. Only one toon in the game with it. That should never been allowed in PvP.

Many other toons have been nerfed before, and we had to adapt, Prisoner owners will do that now.

Remove him from Arena would be ok too, or change it to siege (or something) in Arena.

Not sure make a debuff on everybody would work, as it would still block every other passive in the game first round. Yeah, could cleanse, but that would force Mummy/Visions/Buzz on every defense. (And hope AI would be smart enough to use it). Not to mention if we do cleanse, will that make the passive come back? (don't know how that will work).

About nerfing the real problem for me is the skill shard issue. We should be able to move them around every new patch, major update, nerf etc

I look forward to this update, and also new talismans from BNW, hope we see new compositions at Arena.

But really hope matchmaking and self attack problems are fixed first, that is killing the game for me at the moment.

Cheers
Gmac

[Sag7272]

Not sure make a debuff on everybody would work, as it would still block every other passive in the game first round. Yeah, could cleanse, but that would force Mummy/Visions/Buzz on every defense. (And hope AI would be smart enough to use it). Not to mention if we do cleanse, will that make the passive come back? (don't know how that will work).

Seriously.. I think everyone around have already a set on immunity talismans around to keep key toons runing... No need to cleanse if it just doesn't happen.. hence the "counterability" point... Not used to be the case, now it will no matter how many toons it affects..
Otherwise any PvE use would rely too much on RNG & he'll be a "false positive" red eye for a nice to have but never used super rare toon..

[gmac]

Seriously.. I think everyone around have already a set on immunity talismans around to keep key toons runing... No need to cleanse if it just doesn't happen.. hence the "counterability" point... Not used to be the case, now it will no matter how many toons it affects..
Otherwise any PvE use would rely too much on RNG & he'll be a "false positive" red eye for a nice to have but never used super rare toon..

Hey man,

I really wish Prisoner owners would still be able to use The Prisoner as he is on PvE... btw AoP owners as well! For example, no easy way pass the w troll for us after the update.

Once siege stops working first round things will be leveled on offense (everybody can use new talismans). But killing every passive first round would still be a great advantage both offense and defense, debuff or not. (for instance, dealing with troll shields)

[Sag7272]

Hey man,

I really wish Prisoner owners would still be able to use The Prisoner as he is on PvE... btw AoP owners as well! For example, no easy way pass the w troll for us after the update.

Us including me
I understand your point & I'm somewhat happy to retrieve the "mandatory prisoner spot" from my defense but don't want him nullified either, AoP will work pass first turn, start a HH with a Droid or a red pyro & forget about prisoners in this version no matter his chances of kicking in can be..
Main point was he wasn't counterable... Is he OP once a counter exist, definitely no, rest of that nerf just bury him in a flood of common toons as easily countered & even when working, he likely won't be of any use unless extremely lucky.. I can live without him or my AoP but it's​ way too much... He's directly heading to be benched & should had kept some use..