August 2017 Tuning Discussion - PRELIMINARY

[slauki]

Clairvoyant is fine the way she is at least her power move doesn't deal over 20k worth of damage unlike wrath. I guess he deserves a nerf too.

@Dev can you please consider nerfing wrath power move???

Along with SSD he taunts way too much esp considering the amount of strike talisman that will be available soon???

copy and paste from the weekly pvp thread, so the massage can reach someone

another thing i would like to discuss:
90% of all good defenses have a specific combo of chars, mostly wrath/ssd combo. the red buzz is also getting very popular these days. all in all i feel the only char who can make a significant difference nowadays is wrath.
i think his powermove is somewhat out of line and his standard damage is a too high with the additional aoe buff removal (his fury sucks for sure). he is the char who makes your defense much more dangerous and who can make your life way easier on offense. the possible speed advantage is huge. all who use him to play LOL or knows how easy he cuts through the levels. if you compare this with other chars you will see a significant difference.
so he is still the toon of the moment, despite the reduced removal chances. that said, some adjustments would be necessary for him imo.

[Tridimensionale]

the red buzz is also getting very popular these days.

red buzz powermove seems to be bugged, very hard to take him down... that s why
not sure how the new fix works for him

[Nicko]

Clairvoyant is fine the way she is at least her power move doesn't deal over 20k worth of damage unlike wrath. I guess he deserves a nerf too.

@Dev can you please consider nerfing wrath power move???

Along with SSD he taunts way too much considering the amount of strike talisman that will be available soon???

Ps. Please reconsider buffing vampire hunter power skill from having a 35% chance to grant an extra turn to 100% chance. It's already hard enough dealing with basic attack. Now you're telling me he will also have the ability to grant extra turns, revive all allies and deal a sick amount of damage. Is crazy......man this dude is a beast.

Sorry for the many edits my writing sucks.

Hey Angel - my VHE is sharded and I'll say the Mark skill does very little damage relative to what he can do. But to mark and then be able to use the Dusk skill 100% assured? I agree with you - that's brutal - instant Prisoner death. Great for those of us who have him - not so much for the have-nots.

As far as Wrath, your estimate is way over for the power move. Even a damage-talismaned version doesn't do that much damage. My Wrath - who needs 3 greens to (maybe) keep him alive for more than a round - does about 9k. Less than Nomads power move - you're likely including the marks - but when testing my defense it's pretty rare they get a perfect hit after that to trigger the marks. But guess it's possible. Of course if he's used on offense a human could more readily take advantage - but recently I've left him off my offense - too many issues triggering SSDs with strikes. I know quite a few who also only use him for defense.

I honestly think Beelze is just as bad. Those burns add up fast - his power move can seal exactly at the wrong time with great damage - and his Fury is beastly.

If they ever did nerf Wrath's power move I would hope they buff his fury. Or better yet - just remove it. It's pathetic and works against him on defense if the AI awards it to him instead of Eddie.

These two Demon brothers are definitely powerful - wish i had a Beelze - have a defense all mapped out already

[Monte47]

Seeing the stuff about Wrath.... why do we want a 100% win rate on attacks? What's the fun and challenge in that? People are putting counter strikes on him, and he's a glass tiger. Even my Shaman Eddie can take him out, and he hits like a wet noodle. I'll never get why we don't want a couple of OP players that are a bonus to actually get. New content, less tweaking of toons for a bit? (I'm grouchy cuz I haven't eaten yet, forgive me.)
Eskiggalu

[Nicko]

Seeing the stuff about Wrath.... why do we want a 100% win rate on attacks? What's the fun and challenge in that? People are putting counter strikes on him, and he's a glass tiger. Even my Shaman Eddie can take him out, and he hits like a wet noodle. I'll never get why we don't want a couple of OP players that are a bonus to actually get. New content, less tweaking of toons for a bit? (I'm grouchy cuz I haven't eaten yet, forgive me.)
Eskiggalu

This.

And I don't mean OP - just really powerful. Remember - if everyone has 97% win on offense - that means everyone has on average 3% Holds on defense...

I do think Wrath can do what no other toon can - which leads to easier crowd control - which is one of the very few ways the AI can win. But those of us in the top 50 face him repeatedly - and do just fine most of the time - the occasional loss happens - and that's not a bad thing. And having him doesn't mean instant win - my defense was 18% last week despite Wrath and an SSD...

[Monte47]

This.

And I don't mean OP - just really powerful. Remember - if everyone has 97% win on offense - that means everyone has on average 3% Holds on defense...

I do think Wrath can do what no other toon can - which leads to easier crowd control - which is one of the very few ways the AI can win. But those of us in the top 50 face him repeatedly - and do just fine most of the time - the occasional loss happens - and that's not a bad thing. And having him doesn't mean instant win - my defense was 18% last week despite Wrath and an SSD...

Yes. Mine was 17%, was holding at 32% before I broke 200 rank. Once I was up in the 100, I don't think it held again before reset; I finished 50. My defense always has Wrath, but more for the benefit of the void Talisman to my defense. He crumbles as quickly as any toon, and when I battle him, he almost never gets his special off.

[Monte47]

Well you have to remember not everyone is in the top 50 like you. So of course you can pretty much kill of any team with what you have vs the rest.

Aside from that there are many other factors that play a major role on why your defense probably isn't holding or not. Considering the amount of bugs we have in the game. So until all that is fix you can't accurately judge rather you're defense is good or not. It's like calling someone a liar without having any factual evidence to dispute their claim. While in this case until all the bugs are squashed your hold rate is pretty much dismissible at this point.

At least I know why my team isnt holding.
#The prisoner

Not to argue, but I think the point... at least my point was, defenses don't hold at high percentages even with Wrath above 300 or so. Hell, I let myself fall to the 800's this week, and still only held between 30 and 60%. Even Gmac gets beat, and you'd think the dude would hold at 100% because his game is so on point.

I am curious, your bug comments... are you speaking to the AI and the use of skills, or crashes?

Cheers
Eskiggalu

[Askora]

I think the talisman fixes will alleviate a lot of the issues with Wrath's damage. I use him on offense because of it, but since energy can be grabbed easily it works. Once the talismans work right, it won't be near as good a strategy. On defense I use him more as a buff remover than anything. You can't count on the defense to get perfect hits, so the power move is good for the base damage but not guaranteed for the follow-up damage. On defense you also have to face that he is a Fury liability and can waste what might be a winning move for the defense because he wants to show off that skill.

I agree with Monte47 and Nicko both. Especially like the comment Monte47 made about people wanting 100% on offense. That was the point I was trying to make when I posted my suggestion on having to face the top 100 defenses blind. A few people that don't like it, but the truth is you can't have 100% offense and expect much from defense. Which means that currently the game is set up to favor those who spend the most SoW, something that KAZ stated isn't what they wanted. There should be some advantage to spending more SoW, but right now it's basically pay to win. My defense was around 18% or 19% for the week last week. Reality is that it's boosted at the beginning of the week by lower ranked teams attacking me and losing and by the end of the week it's barely holding. It's more likely beginning of the week is 35% to 50% and by the end of the week it's 5% to 10%. Doubtful that'll change.

[R1ck]

Pay to win? Where is the ability and time to be able to be on high ranks? People there make that possible with almost the same toons we all have, that should be respected.

[slauki]

Seeing the stuff about Wrath.... why do we want a 100% win rate on attacks? What's the fun and challenge in that? People are putting counter strikes on him, and he's a glass tiger. Even my Shaman Eddie can take him out, and he hits like a wet noodle. I'll never get why we don't want a couple of OP players that are a bonus to actually get. New content, less tweaking of toons for a bit? (I'm grouchy cuz I haven't eaten yet, forgive me.)
Eskiggalu

I think the talisman fixes will alleviate a lot of the issues with Wrath's damage. I use him on offense because of it, but since energy can be grabbed easily it works. Once the talismans work right, it won't be near as good a strategy. On defense I use him more as a buff remover than anything. You can't count on the defense to get perfect hits, so the power move is good for the base damage but not guaranteed for the follow-up damage. On defense you also have to face that he is a Fury liability and can waste what might be a winning move for the defense because he wants to show off that skill.

I agree with Monte47 and Nicko both. Especially like the comment Monte47 made about people wanting 100% on offense. That was the point I was trying to make when I posted my suggestion on having to face the top 100 defenses blind. A few people that don't like it, but the truth is you can't have 100% offense and expect much from defense. Which means that currently the game is set up to favor those who spend the most SoW, something that KAZ stated isn't what they wanted. There should be some advantage to spending more SoW, but right now it's basically pay to win. My defense was around 18% or 19% for the week last week. Reality is that it's boosted at the beginning of the week by lower ranked teams attacking me and losing and by the end of the week it's barely holding. It's more likely beginning of the week is 35% to 50% and by the end of the week it's 5% to 10%. Doubtful that'll change.

fully agree guys 100% wins is not a good situation. i think great players should have 96+ but that's about it. only thing that mocks me is that this guy is outstanding. nothing can compare with him and there is no real counterunit to him. it's not a bad scenario like beta prisoner but wrath somewhat out of line. same with gunner rescuer. i use this girl 90% of the time on offense and it feels sometimes like cheating to be honest. she is the other toon that is out of line because of this outstanding powermove. curious to see what the new changes will bring, but it's not okay if 2-3 toons are so much better then similar toons of the same rarity (fun fact GCR is a 4* ).