April 2017 Tuning Discussion - PRELIMINARY

[Nicko]

For sure Tritium that would be sick! Just noticed you're over 10k in VP Jofer lol 😆 No wonder you're answering questions on the forum.... week 7 (or 8?) pretty much locked up.... go Nicko lol!

No worries. Just watch me score 4000 points in the last 25 minutes.

You're going down Jofer

[Silentknight]

No worries. Just watch me score 4000 points in the last 25 minutes.

You're going down Jofer

LOL,everybody showing up! Congrats Nicko!!!

[Ubajoa]

Go nicko cast him a pyroblast.

[Patrice-1201]

nerfing is really not the solution, I do not have a Prisoner, but he really is no issue. For me the issue is that I got attacked 133 times more than I actually attacked and that I have to spend so much Ironite just to catch up... If you count 14 points loss on average per attack, I lost 390 Ironites and 1892 points just on the imbalance... If I had been attacked like Nicko only 40% of my attacks then I lost > 4000 points... This is what makes me sick.

The nerfing seems to be an excuse to lead us to think that things are improving nut making sure we keep spending... It clearly isn't the answer and has people pissed off all over the forums...

[DaveMurray]

nerfing is really not the solution, I do not have a Prisoner, but he really is no issue. For me the issue is that I got attacked 133 times more than I actually attacked and that I have to spend so much Ironite just to catch up... If you count 14 points loss on average per attack, I lost 390 Ironites and 1892 points just on the imbalance... If I had been attacked like Nicko only 40% of my attacks then I lost > 4000 points... This is what makes me sick.

The nerfing seems to be an excuse to lead us to think that things are improving nut making sure we keep spending... It clearly isn't the answer and has people pissed off all over the forums...

Exactly, i don't have a prisoner and i am pretty sure that i will never get one with the current RNG even if i play for 10 years but nerfing is not the answer.
Instead i propose:
i) Remove revenge to balance the defence attacks, i did 10 attacks then i get attacked 5 times cause AI is trying to balance my attacks and then i get 10 revenges so it's 10-15
ii) OP a few common toons that most players have or are easy to get by adding new passives and improving their skills so there are more options to choose
iii) Fix the toss that decides who goes first
iv) Fix the f***ing point system, f.e. when i don't go first and end up loosing without playing at all because of taunt, stun, freeze it's not right to loose more points than what i gain at win
v) Remove the prioritisation to defence that leads the AI to proc everything for the defence team(void shield, stun, taunt, freeze, burn, multi attacks etc)
vi) Fix things that are broken or bugged, like talismans f.e., it helps in balance

[scott-5496]

nerfing is really not the solution, I do not have a Prisoner, but he really is no issue. For me the issue is that I got attacked 133 times more than I actually attacked and that I have to spend so much Ironite just to catch up... If you count 14 points loss on average per attack, I lost 390 Ironites and 1892 points just on the imbalance... If I had been attacked like Nicko only 40% of my attacks then I lost > 4000 points... This is what makes me sick.

The nerfing seems to be an excuse to lead us to think that things are improving nut making sure we keep spending... It clearly isn't the answer and has people pissed off all over the forums...

I pretty much agree with all of that - nerfing (other than fixes to try to improve toons) is not the way forward. Bring in new toons that can help or like you did with talisman as I use immunity and it works just fine and is a great counter to almost everything except a fully sharded GRE - if it get the RNG it is game over for one toon and a few nails in the coffin of another...is he the current new OP toon?

[Tridimensionale]

I pretty much agree with all of that - nerfing (other than fixes to try to improve toons) is not the way forward. Bring in new toons that can help or like you did with talisman as I use immunity and it works just fine and is a great counter to almost everything except a fully sharded GRE - if it get the RNG it is game over for one toon and a few nails in the coffin of another...is he the current new OP toon?

Nope.. i think i have 100% win rate (attacks) against GR teams no matter what the toons are, no matter the coin... i use viking eddie but i think any other maxed sentinel toon could do the trick.. he deals lots of damage but it s really fragile.

Trust me when i say maxed Carriage Rider Eddie is waaaay harder to put down

Mummy taunt teams the worst match up for me (even with immunity talisman).. good to read is going to get nerfed

[iPoop]

I’ve always been taught that you play the cards you’ve been dealt. Not the ones you wish you had, but the ones you’ve been dealt…and you play them to the best of your ability!

We’ve all been dealt certain characters as a result of our game play, our investment of time or even money. And once we’ve been dealt these characters, we’ve made decisions on selling them or further investing into them.

In my humble opinion, it’s incredibly demotivating that after the cards have been dealt and decisions around investments made, that someone can actually come and change the cards in my hand, ala nerfing. I do not care if they believe its justified via some “fairness” objective, the nerfing just makes me no longer want to play and invest in character development. That’s sad too since I’ve been essentially an everyday player since ~August of last year.

I believe the proper solution to the balance the Dev’s seek still lies in creation, not removal. Create new characters and talisman that require further investment. Introduce a character like St. Michael the Archangel who’s passive would remove the Prisoner’s passive. Don’t want to use an angel, call it the Prisoner’s Mother for all I care.

Sure, you tried a bit of this with the introduction of two new talismans. It may not have completely levelled the playing field, but the Immunity talis can help mitigate tauntfest. Now don’t just give up and swing the nerf bat, keep going and expand the meta further. If you want suggestions, we are a creative bunch, just solicit ideas from us. You’ll have more ideas than you’ll know what to do with if you ask.

Regressing all characters to a mean in order to achieve some sense of fairness is not a fruitful direction of the game. That is a road to nowhere. I recommend a different path…

P.S. I do not have a Prisoner, W. Troll, AoF or many other great characters. I hope to one day…but that hope will be lost if the nerf bat continues to swing.

[Jofer16]

I’ve always been taught that you play the cards you’ve been dealt. Not the ones you wish you had, but the ones you’ve been dealt…and you play them to the best of your ability!

We’ve all been dealt certain characters as a result of our game play, our investment of time or even money. And once we’ve been dealt these characters, we’ve made decisions on selling them or further investing into them.

In my humble opinion, it’s incredibly demotivating that after the cards have been dealt and decisions around investments made, that someone can actually come and change the cards in my hand, ala nerfing. I do not care if they believe its justified via some “fairness” objective, the nerfing just makes me no longer want to play and invest in character development. That’s sad too since I’ve been essentially an everyday player since ~August of last year.

I believe the proper solution to the balance the Dev’s seek still lies in creation, not removal. Create new characters and talisman that require further investment. Introduce a character like St. Michael the Archangel who’s passive would remove the Prisoner’s passive. Don’t want to use an angel, call it the Prisoner’s Mother for all I care.

Sure, you tried a bit of this with the introduction of two new talismans. It may not have completely levelled the playing field, but the Immunity talis can help mitigate tauntfest. Now don’t just give up and swing the nerf bat, keep going and expand the meta further. If you want suggestions, we are a creative bunch, just solicit ideas from us. You’ll have more ideas than you’ll know what to do with if you ask.

Regressing all characters to a mean in order to achieve some sense of fairness is not a fruitful direction of the game. That is a road to nowhere. I recommend a different path…

P.S. I do not have a Prisoner, W. Troll, AoF or many other great characters. I hope to one day…but that hope will be lost if the nerf bat continues to swing.

Great Post.

[Tritium]

*Eloquent and thoughtful post*

I agree with everything you said. You just about summed up how a good deal of the playerbase likely feels regarding this.